Anyone considering voting for B. Obama?

[crmann]

Just thought I'd share...

Blessings,
From The Old Timer

Author unknown

This election has me very worried. So many things to consider. About a year ago I would have voted for Obama. I have changed my mind three times since than. I watch all the news channels, jumping from one to another. I must say this drives my husband crazy. But, I feel if you view _http://www.msnbc.msn.com/_ (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/) MSNBC, CNN, and _http://www.foxnews.com/_ (http://www.foxnews.com/) Fox News, you might get some middle ground to work with.



About six months ago, I started thinking "where did the money come from for Obama". I have four daughters who went to College, and we were middle class, and money was tight. We (including my girls) worked hard and there were lots of student loans. I started looking into Obama's life. Around 1979 Obama started college at Occidental in California. He is very open about his two years at Occidental, he tried all kinds of drugs and was wasting his time but, even though he had a brilliant mind, did not apply himself to his studies. "Barry" (that was the name he used all his life) during this time had two roommates, Muhammad Hasan Chandoo and Wahid Hamid, both from Pakistan. During the summer of 1981, after his second year in college, he made a "round the world" trip. Stopping to see his mother in Indonesia, next Hyderabad in India, three weeks in Karachi, Pakistan where he stayed with his roommate's family, then off to Africa to visit his father's family.



My question - Where did he get the money for this trip? Neither I, nor any one of my children would have had money for a trip like this when they where in college. When he came back he started school at Columbia University in New York. It is at this time he wants everyone to call him Barack - not Barry. Do you know what the tuition is at Columbia? It's not cheap to say the least. Where did he get money for tuition? Student Loans? Maybe.



After Columbia, he went to Chicago to work as a Community Organizer for $12,000. a year. Why Chicago? Why not New York? He was already living in New York. By "chance" he met Antoin "Tony" Rezko, born in Aleppo, Syria, and a real estate developer in Chicago. Rezko has been convicted of fraud and bribery this year. Rezko, was named "Entrepreneur of the Decade" by the Arab-American Business and Professional Association".



About two years later, Obama entered Harvard Law School. Do you have any idea what tuition is for Harvard Law School? Where did he get the money for Law School? More student loans?



After Law school, he went back to Chicago. Rezko offered him a job, which he turned down. But, he did take a job with Davis, Miner, Barnhill & Galland. Guess what? They represented "Rezar" which Rezko's firm. Rezko was one of Obama's first major financial contributors when he ran for office in Chicago. In 2003, Rezko threw an early fundraiser for Obama which Chicago Tribune reporter David Mendelland claims was instrumental in providing Obama with "seed money" for his U.S. Senate race. In 2005, Obama purchased a new home in Kenwoood District of Chicago for $1.65 million (less than asking price).



With ALL those Student Loans - Where did he get the money for the property? On the same day Rezko's wife, Rita, purchased the adjoining empty lot for full price. The London Times reported that Nadhmi Auchi, an Iraqi-born billionaire, loaned Rezko $3.5 million three weeks before Obama's new home was purchased. Obama met Nadhmi Auchi many times with Rezko. Now, we have Obama running for President.



Valerie Jarrett was Michele Obama's boss. She is now Obama's chief advisor and he does not make any major decisions without talking to her first. Where was Jarrett born? Ready for this? Shiraz, Iran! Do we see a pattern here? Or am I going crazy? On May 10, 2008 The Times reported, Robert Malley advisor to Obama was "sacked" after the press found out he was having regular contacts with "Hamas", which controls Gaza and is connected with Iran.



This past week, buried in the back part of the papers, Iraqi newspapers reported that during Obama's visit to Iraq, he asked their leaders to do nothing about the war until after he is elected, and he will "Take care of things".



Oh, and by the way, remember the college roommates that where born in Pakistan? They are in charge of all those "small" Internet campaign contribution for Obama. Where is that money coming from? The poor and middle class in this country? Or could it be from the Middle East. And the final bit of news. On September 7, 2008, The Washington Times posted a verbal slip that was made on "This Week" with George Stephanapoulos. Obama on talking about his religion said, "My Muslim faith". When questioned, "he make a mistake". Some mistake! All of the above information I got on line. If you would like to check it - Wikipedia, encyclopedia, Barack Obama; Tony Rezko; Valerie Jarrett: Daily Times - Obama visited Pakistan in 1981; The Washington Times - September 7, 2008; The Times May 10, 2008. Now the BIG question - If I found out all this information on my own, Why haven't all of our "intelligent" members of the press been reporting this?



A phrase that keeps ringing in my ear - "Beware of the enemy from within"!!!

[ilovejesus2]

I hold the belief that Obama is one of the contenders for Antichrist.

Along with Solana and Sarkozy

NO... I would not vote for him

[T-Minus?]

Only if I backslide!! Maranatha!!

[D4Christ]

Where did Barack get the money to go to college?? I went on scholarships, grants and loans. What is so sinister about that and what is it any of our business. Do you worry about how McCain's kids get to college..don't worry. Cindy is an heiress and her $300,000 outfit that she wore during the RNC would put more than a few kids through school. Do you really think that when you can wear the cost of someone's house, tuition, and salaries on you back that they are really going to worry about what happens to the everyday working man or woman? Don't hold your breath.

But in response to your question. I will vote for Obama (and not "That one" a phrase McCain's campaign is silly enough to consider using) and I will take my kids in the booth with me as we make history.


Barack the Vote!!

[shampoo]

make history

No matter who gets elected, history is always made.

[burien1]

I consider it my business because this man might rule our country. Is he THAT brilliant that he earned enough scholarships to get him into one of the most prestigious, as well as most expensive schools ? If he is, I sincerely hope he will use that brilliance for the good of the country and not for evil. Inquiring minds would like to know.

[D4Christ]

I consider it my business because this man might rule our country. Is he THAT brilliant that he earned enough scholarships to get him into one of the most prestigious, as well as most expensive schools ? If he is, I sincerely hope he will use that brilliance for the good of the country and not for evil. Inquiring minds would like to know.

Barack didn't have a rich daddy like Bush to put him thru school. Do you somehow find it difficult to be believe that someone like Barack could have earned a scholarhsip thru school? It must be who you know, because I know many brilliant people on scholarship to Ivy league schools.

And I agree, I hope he uses his brilliance for the good of the people too.

[crmann]

Interesting!

Interesting comments.

John 12:39-40 "Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again, He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them."

Even if the consequences be suffered, the eyes will still not be opened.

Blessings,

The Old Timer

[jesusistheway]

You know there is so much contraversy sorrounding Barack Obama. Too much for me. His book which is contradicting to his public statements. His past which is blurry at best. The man even talks like a foreigner. Pay attention to that next time you listen to him speak. In particular, the way he says Pakistan. We Americans pronounce it Pack-i-stan. Obama pronounces it Poc-e-ston. Sorry, but that is foreign. He went to college with Middle Easterners. Spent time in the Middle East. Associates with people in Chicago (which is a hot bed of scum if there ever was one), who are from the Middle East. People are blind. We are being blindsided. YBIC, Ron

[burien1]

You are right . It probably is who I know, religious, gun toting hick that I am . My son is brilliant, with an extremely high IQ. He was not able to go to the school of his dreams because of finances and not enough scholarships. It most likely boiled down to who he didn`t know. He worked his way through college beginning in High school. College kids still need spending money to eat, buy books, and to live.

But that is only my experience. He knows his Bible, though. And I`ll take wisdom from God over brilliance any day. I know an old man that never graduated high school, but he could make you or I, look like an idiot, on just about any subject. He`s read his Bible his whole life and has more wisdom in his little finger than Obama has with all his education.
I`ll take friends like that over a thousand ivy leaguers any day!!! They are the kind of people I want to surround myself with.


You inferred it was no one`s business how he was able to go to Harvard. I`m telling you it most certainly is the business of every US citizen. Every candidate`s life should be held up to scrutiny. They may become the ruler of a superpower. I like to know facts about a candidate. Not what they spoon feed us. Not slanders or insinuations. Not gossip. Just the plain, simple truth. Only the Truth. I`m still investigating all the candidates. But I really don`t need any further evidence on Obama. His own words on a variety of subjects, have shown me I won`t vote for him. And yeah, I know, whatever he says can change the next day, so I really shouldn`t hold him to anything he says.

There is enough facts presented in the threads on this board, that would convince most open-minded people about his Socialist agenda. It`s alright for you to slander and help The National Enquirer spread unsubstantiated gossip about Palin. It`s alright for you to make fun of the way a fellow Christian even talks. But you find it YOUR business, to put in print on a Christian board, slanders and gossip about Palin`s marriage that you just happen to hear. But you say it is none of OUR business to want to know the facts about Obama`s Harvard education. I really can`t see how you consider that fair.

YSIC,
Brenda

[IamtheWalrus]

Obama and McCain are both in bed with the Elite, and will both enact their agendas with flavors of either side they represent.
Presidents are puppets of a much larger, more sinister group. Who you are voting for doesn't really matter, and hasn't since George Bush Sr.
Reagan was the last good president we ever had, and even he was pressured from the powers within.
Don't fool yourself, but exercise your vote, as much as it really doesn't matter, it will help your conscience and you will be able to sleep at night.
My vote is to McCain, unless I change my mind at the last minute and vote for Ron Paul...either way, they all work for the same camp.
I drank my coffee a long time ago when I saw the signs, and the biggest wake up call was 911.
The evidence is there, but are you willing to look at it and see the truth behind the lies?

Remember these three words, and remember them well:

Council on Foreign Relations

They are in control, whether you want to believe it or not.
They are just a branch for the most evil men in the world, and they will get their way.

[crmann]

Brenda wrote:
"There is enough facts presented in the threads on this board, that would convince most open-minded people about his Socialist agenda."

Hi, Brenda.... The masses are blind to this fact about Obama. He thinks the government can solve all our problems, and the masses are swallowing this thinking bait, sinker and line.

The next time you hear him promise to provide an education for every child in the U.S., ask the question, "What kind of education?" Very likely it won't be the kind of education God's people would want their children to be under.

The more control and power the government is given, the less freedom we citizens will have...

Control, control, control...

We have gone beyond the point of no return.

Blessings,

The Old Timer

[crmann]

Hello, IamtheWalrus..

How's the weather in Seattle?

Here in the mountains of western, NC, we've got rain, rain, rain... probably the rest of the day, tonight, and all day tomorrow.

Quote: "Council on Foreign Relations

They are in control, whether you want to believe it or not.
They are just a branch for the most evil men in the world, and they will get their way."

No, Iamthe Walrus.... they think they are... but, God is still in charge...

Blessings,

The Old Timer

[WhiteH2OWoman]

Barack didn't have a rich daddy like Bush to put him thru school. Do you somehow find it difficult to be believe that someone like Barack could have earned a scholarhsip thru school? It must be who you know, because I know many brilliant people on scholarship to Ivy league schools.

Yeah...but did they go out and buy a $1.65 MILLION dollar house right out of school? With an arab friend buying the lot next door?

My answer to the original question: ABSOLUTELY NOT. I do not trust him any further than I could throw him.

[WhiteH2OWoman]

In particular, the way he says Pakistan. We Americans pronounce it Pack-i-stan. Obama pronounces it Poc-e-ston. Sorry, but that is foreign. He went to college with Middle Easterners. Spent time in the Middle East. Associates with people in Chicago (which is a hot bed of scum if there ever was one), who are from the Middle East. People are blind. We are being blindsided. YBIC, Ron

AMEN! The phrase "Trojan horse" comes to mind...

And I agree with IamtheWalrus...the New World Order has been hedging their bets for quite some time with candidates on both sides. I know I'm voting for the lesser of 2 evils...but I sure as heck don't want the worst one!

[burien1]

Interesting!

Interesting comments.

John 12:39-40 "Therefore they could not believe, because that Esaias said again, He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them."

Even if the consequences be suffered, the eyes will still not be opened.

Blessings,

The Old Timer

[IamtheWalrus]

No, Iamthe Walrus.... they think they are... but, God is still in charge...

Blessings,

The Old Timer

You are absolutlely correct. Just as God hardened Pharaoh's heart and softened Nebuchadnezzar, just as He does to each and every person in this world.
Who wins the election will be appointed by God to fulfill His plan, as he hardens and softens each of our hearts to vote for whom we decide.

[crmann]

You are absolutlely correct. Just as God hardened Pharaoh's heart and softened Nebuchadnezzar, just as He does to each and every person in this world.
Who wins the election will be appointed by God to fulfill His plan, as he hardens and softens each of our hearts to vote for whom we decide.

God will determine who will be the next president of the United States..

All that is going on in this presidential campaign is foolishness with the Lord.. God has already chosen the next president of the United States...
And, I believe it will be a leader this nation now deserves..... This nation has turned away from God. Thus, our next president, I believe, will be an ungodly leader...

Jeremiah 18:5 Then the Lord said to me, 6 “I, the Lord, say: ‘O nation of Israel, can I not deal with you as this potter deals with the clay? In my hands, you, O nation of Israel, are just like the clay in this potter’s hand.’ 7 There are times, Jeremiah, when I threaten to uproot, tear down, and destroy a nation or kingdom. 8 But if that nation I threatened stops doing wrong, I will cancel the destruction I intended to do to it. 9 And there are times when I promise to build up and establish a nation or kingdom. 10 But if that nation does what displeases me and does not obey me, then I will cancel the good I promised to do to it. 11 So now, tell the people of Judah and the citizens of Jerusalem this: The Lord says, ‘I am preparing to bring disaster on you! I am making plans to punish you. So, every one of you, stop the evil things you have been doing. Correct the way you have been living and do what is right.’ 12 But they just keep saying, ‘We do not care what you say! We will do whatever we want to do! We will continue to behave wickedly and stubbornly!’”

Many other verses confirm that God's purposes in regards to human history cannot fail. "The Lord nullifies the counsel of the nations; He frustrates the plans of the peoples. The counsel of the Lord stands forever, the plans of His heart from generation to generation" (Psalm 33:10, 11).

God has not given control of history over to humans. Instead, this verse is clear that God takes action to frustrate human plans whenever He desires--which means whenever they are not in line with His plans. Since God's counsel must "stand forever" and since God will, as Isaiah says, accomplish all of His "good pleasure," He will frustrate all human plans that will not lead to the fulfillment of His plans. From this it follows that the only things which He will allow to happen are things which will ultimately contribute to the fulfillment of His plans.

God controls the affairs of nations: "He makes the nations great, then destroys them; He enlarges the nations, then leads them away" (Job 12:23). "For the kingdom is the Lord's, and He rules over the nations" (Psalm 22:28). The land boundaries of each nation and their period in history are all determined by God: "and He made from one, every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined their appointed times, and the boundaries of their habitation" (Acts 17:26). Not only that, God also determines which specific individuals will be the leaders in each country: "And it is He who changes the times and the epochs; He removes kings and establishes kings; He gives wisdom to wise men, and knowledge to men of understanding" (Daniel 2:21). "The Most High is ruler over the realm of mankind, and bestows it on whom he wishes..." (Daniel 4:17). God made it absolutely clear to King Nebuchadnezzar that he was not ultimately in charge, rather "it is Heaven that rules" (Daniel 4:26). Paul even tells us that the wicked Pharaoh at the time of the Exodus had been "raised up" by God so that He could show His power in defeating Him (Romans 9:17).

God controls the wind and lightning (Psalm 135:7), the snow and the rain (Job 37:6-13), and directs the stars in their courses (Job 38:32). Forest fires, hail, and storms are all under his command: "Fire and hail, snow and clouds; stormy wind, fulfilling His word" (Psalm 148:8). The sun does not simply rise on its own each day, rather God "causes His sun to rise" (Matt. 5:45). Neither does the grass grow on its own, but God "causes the grass to grow" (Psalm 104:14). God feeds the animals (Matthew 6:26; Psalm 104:27-29) and indeed controls even the most seemingly insignificant death of a sparrow (Matthew 10:29). God sends rain and withholds rain (Amos 4:7-10). There is nothing in the universe left to chance: "The lot is cast in the lap, but its every decision is wholly from the Lord" (Proverbs 16:33). Nothing in all creation--the weather, the stars, the plants, the animals, the affairs of nations, the role of dice, and the specific details of our lives--is outside of the sovereign control of God.

"And He made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined their appointed times and the boundaries of their habitations, that they would seek God, if perhaps they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us." (Acts 17:26-27)

[tara]

I was shocked to see people on this Board who would even consider voting for Obama. He supports abortion and also supports the homosexual agenda. A vote for him will place the blood of all the murdured aborted children on your hands! You must examine the Scripture and find out which candidate lines up closest with what the Word of God teaches. John McCain was certainly not my first choice as a candidate, but he is a much better choice than Obama when you look at these moral issues!

[joyfulchild]

Hey Tara I couldnt agree more.I cannot BELIEVE in fact Im almost TONGUE TIED with shock that any christian would consider supporting a man who supports not just ABORTION which is bad enough BUT LATE TERM ABORTION!!!!Before you consider your vote as you "MAKE HISTORY" as you say why not consider what your Father in Heaven will say to you when he replays THAT PART OF YOUR LIFE WHERE YOU VOTED FOR A MURDERER.
Please reconsider before you criticise Christians on this thread for NOT voting for Obama.

[jesusistheway]

I was listening to Hannity today and he had Kersey on the phone, I think that is his name. The author who was detained in Africa. This guy was saying that he had documented evidence that Obama is supporting/discussing election issues with someone named Obinga? This guy is a muslim trying to install shiria law? Don't know if all this is true but the guy will be on Hannity and Comes this coming Monday. He said he will give the documents to Hannity. I know that God is controlling what will happen. America has to fade in power in order for Israel to be left standing alone. I just cannot get over the controversy that is swirling around this man Obama. A lot of which comes right out his own book. He appears to be a suave/smooth talker. But what are his true motives? Has anyone out there read any of Joel Rosenberg's books? Scary scenerios. YBIC, Ron

[crmann]

In the long run, also consider the possibility of the next president being in a position to appoint the next supreme court justice... Obama would most likely appoint a very liberal person....

Blessings,

The Old Timer

[jesusistheway]

Blessings to you, Old timer. Enjoying the rain? We just planted apple and peach trees. So we need it. Probably the same storm that is hitting you. I am in the process of looking up the people that are connected to Obama. It is hard to know what to believe. I wish I had a known trustworthy site to go to for information. How many Supreme Courts seats will come up if he gets elected? I haven't heard of anymore retirements yet. YBIC, Ron

[D4Christ]

You are right . It probably is who I know, religious, gun toting hick that I am .

Your words not mine.

But that is only my experience. He knows his Bible, though. And I`ll take wisdom from God over brilliance any day. I know an old man that never graduated high school, but he could make you or I, look like an idiot, on just about any subject. He`s read his Bible his whole life and has more wisdom in his little finger than Obama has with all his education.
I`ll take friends like that over a thousand ivy leaguers any day!!! They are the kind of people I want to surround myself with.

Good for you.

You inferred it was no one`s business how he was able to go to Harvard. I`m telling you it most certainly is the business of every US citizen. Every candidate`s life should be held up to scrutiny. They may become the ruler of a superpower. I like to know facts about a candidate. Not what they spoon feed us. Not slanders or insinuations. Not gossip. Just the plain, simple truth. Only the Truth. I`m still investigating all the candidates. But I really don`t need any further evidence on Obama. His own words on a variety of subjects, have shown me I won`t vote for him. And yeah, I know, whatever he says can change the next day, so I really shouldn`t hold him to anything he says.

I know just what you mean. When McCain said about Palin, 'Once you get to know her like I know her...' and come to find out he had only met her once.... I thought to myself, 'What a liar...this is jus a stunt because you are dropping behind Obama.'

There is enough facts presented in the threads on this board, that would convince most open-minded people about his Socialist agenda. It`s alright for you to slander and help The National Enquirer spread unsubstantiated gossip about Palin.

No....the dumb stuff Palin says I saw with my own eyes...and it is on youtube too!

It`s alright for you to make fun of the way a fellow Christian even talks.

Its my opinon. She sounds phony and folksy to a fault. It comes off of very forced and insincere. What...does she thinks she can wink at American and we all will believe her....apparently yes. And for the record, everytime someone says they are a Christian, I don't automatically believe them. I get different vibes her and they all don't say Holy. Btw, its not her accent I find funny...its what she says or a lack thereof that I find humorus.

But you find it YOUR business, to put in print on a Christian board, slanders and gossip about Palin`s marriage that you just happen to hear. But you say it is none of OUR business to want to know the facts about Obama`s Harvard education. I really can`t see how you consider that fair.

Is this a Christian board....really? Have you seen the outrageous assumptions about Obama or do you just think that every horrid thing that is written on this board about him is true because he doesn't look like you? There is much slanderous gossip going on...a lot of which has been disproven, but I don't hear anyone making any objections. So, yes I wrote something that I heard a preacher say. He said two interesting things. One - Palin slept with her husbands business partner and two - it took her 7 years to get a Bachelors degree. I have already conceded that the first may not be true. But I have seen the second verified on reputable sites. So, given that the 2nd is true I made an assumption the 1st was also. It may or may not be but at least I am the only person so far on this board to suggest that maybe some of the lies floating around are not true.

But regardless of your opinions, I wil not be scared away tby he scare tactics of the McCain campaign that have infultrated those Americans that feel they have something to loose with Obama as president. Its a shame, but the rhetoric out there makes me feel like I am in the middle of the 60s instead of 2008.

[D4Christ]

Barack didn't have a rich daddy like Bush to put him thru school. Do you somehow find it difficult to be believe that someone like Barack could have earned a scholarhsip thru school? It must be who you know, because I know many brilliant people on scholarship to Ivy league schools.

Yeah...but did they go out and buy a $1.65 MILLION dollar house right out of school? With an arab friend buying the lot next door?

My answer to the original question: ABSOLUTELY NOT. I do not trust him any further than I could throw him.

That's good Wh20. You shouldn't be throwing anyone with your bad knee. I hope you are feeling better.

[D4Christ]

I was shocked to see people on this Board who would even consider voting for Obama. He supports abortion and also supports the homosexual agenda. A vote for him will place the blood of all the murdured aborted children on your hands! You must examine the Scripture and find out which candidate lines up closest with what the Word of God teaches. John McCain was certainly not my first choice as a candidate, but he is a much better choice than Obama when you look at these moral issues!

I was shocked to realize FP was a Republican board. I never knew that most people had never voted for a democrat before (considering that democrats support choice). But I am curious where are all the HIllary supporters that I saw before...you know she supports choice too.

Anyway Palin herself said that during the Vp debate she supported equal rights for homosexuals but that she did not agree with changing the legal definition of marriage between a man and a woman. She agreed with Biden...what a coincidence.

As far as abortion goes for those who cannot imagine taking a life....Does it not concern you that McCain has changed his mind about using embryonic stem cells. First for it, now against. He disapproves of farming embryonic cells for research but has no problems destroying the ones that become available in other ways. How many more babies are destroyed even before they get a chance to gestate. What about those poor babies? Does anyone keep count on that?

And why has no prolifer on this board taken the challenge to ask for Federal intervention against the causes for abortion? Abortion is a sin but the sin of fornication it took to get there is even worse for man's body per scriptures. So why not advocate for penalties for fornication outside of G-ds laws. Why not bring back chasity belts and penalties and fines for those who can be found to have had fornicated without a husband? Abortion is the last step, why not prevent it from the beginning? Or will laws against fornication complicate the lifestyles of too many "christians."

No...I won't have blood on my hands. Each person is doing what they accuse the other of. And too many Christians won't even take the next step because their sins overshadow the root causes for aborition...lust. You won't find too many people to want to give that one up.

Deirdre

[I've Seen Angels]

I was shocked to see people on this Board who would even consider voting for Obama. He supports abortion and also supports the homosexual agenda. A vote for him will place the blood of all the murdured aborted children on your hands! You must examine the Scripture and find out which candidate lines up closest with what the Word of God teaches. John McCain was certainly not my first choice as a candidate, but he is a much better choice than Obama when you look at these moral issues!

Tara

When we stand before the Lord we will not be able to hide the truth...When He asks "Did you care for My children?" Remember He will not only be talking abut the born but the unborn....we will be held accountable for our votes ...you can't hide from God your actions...........also if you did take note last night....neither candidate would say that they would come to Israel's rescue if they were attacked by Iran...........Our nation is no longer a nation of God but a selfish nation who would put a man with fancy talk in the White House without weighing him the balances of what is right and wrong.We have an obligation to be Christians regardless of what our race, creed or color.....neither man is perfect but there is one who actually has Christian values and one who can't even produce a legal birth certificate...please consider prayer before making that vote.....God first!

Gail

[D4Christ]

Hey Tara I couldnt agree more.I cannot BELIEVE in fact Im almost TONGUE TIED with shock that any christian would consider supporting a man who supports not just ABORTION which is bad enough BUT LATE TERM ABORTION!!!!Before you consider your vote as you "MAKE HISTORY" as you say why not consider what your Father in Heaven will say to you when he replays THAT PART OF YOUR LIFE WHERE YOU VOTED FOR A MURDERER.
Please reconsider before you criticise Christians on this thread for NOT voting for Obama.

McCain who supports using embyonic stem cells is a murder too...life starts at conception right? So I guess, that anyone voting for either candiate or has ever voted democratic is a murder. Gee, thanks. I'm sure all those folks appreciate your opinion.

And for the record...I am the only one being critized for my opinion. Reread the thread...this is not a McCain campaign and you cannot just make stuff up. I have stated clearly how I feel about McCain and clearly how I feel about Obama. I have never told anyone they were not a Christian or voting for the devil, nor have I criticizded anyone for their choices. The same cannot be said for most of you.

As as far as G-d goes, you let me deal with my Father. If the question comes up I will tell him I voted for my conscious for the two less than perfect candidates that He placed before me.

YSIC,
Deirdre

[D4Christ]

When we stand before the Lord we will not be able to hide the truth...When He asks "Did you care for My children?" Remember He will not only be talking abut the born but the unborn....we will be held accountable for our votes ...you can't hide from God your actions...........also if you did take note last night....neither candidate would say that they would come to Israel's rescue if they were attacked by Iran...........Our nation is no longer a nation of God but a selfish nation who would put a man with fancy talk in the White House without weighing him the balances of what is right and wrong.We have an obligation to be Christians regardless of what our race, creed or color.....neither man is perfect but there is one who actually has Christian values and one who can't even produce a legal birth certificate...please consider prayer before making that vote.....God first!

Gail

Right, McCain's "Christian values involve killing embryos, having an adulterous affair, and cussing out his colleagues. I guess killing embryos is okay with you then. So, if a woman gets rid of her embryo before a certain stage is it still abortion then? I mean...where do you think they get the embryos from?

I am not sure at this point why many on this board debate the issue. Unless you're a hypocrite, the standards to which many of you hold Obama would not allow you to vote for any candidate at this rate.

Is it that it is easier to jump on the murder ban wagon? Even though sin is sin in G-ds eye and G-d said sexual sin is worse because of what it does to the body murder seems to the be defining factor for most. I guess murder would be easier to rally against considering that most have not murdered but for fornication....let's just say the numbers are higher.

[burien1]

D3Christ wrote;

Is this a Christian board....really? Have you seen the outrageous assumptions about Obama or do you just think that every horrid thing that is written on this board about him is true because he doesn't look like you?

Do they train all Obama supporters to play the race card? It seems to be a tactic employed when presented with the truth. In my posts on this board, I presented you with articles that quoted what came out of the man`s own mouth. If the truth is considered outrageous assumptions by you, so be it. But you have absolutely no reason to assume or insinuate that I am a racsist. I`m your sister in Christ, and you have no good reason to slur me like that. You obviously don`t want the truth no matter what, so to each there own. You really ought to take a chill pill.

YSIC,
Brenda

[Sparrow]

Symptoms: Brainwashing [YouTube]

http://www.rapturealert.com/2008/100608brainwashed.asp



Brainwashing & "Education Reform"


Strategies used in China and other Communist countries as described by Edward Hunter in his 1956 book:

Brainwashing: The story of the men who defied it

http://www.crossroad.to/Quotes/brainwashing.html





The intentional process of radical social change demands continual tension or crisis. These may be spontaneous or manufactured. This book helped lay the foundation for the psycho-social strategies that have transformed education and culture around the world. Based on the research begun at Tavistock (England), continued at the Frankfurt Institute (Germany) then moved to MIT, Columbia University, Stanford and various tax-funded "Educational Laboratories" after World War II, it established the strategies for brainwashing that now permeate our schools, media and organizations. See Brainwashing in America


http://www.crossroad.to/Quotes/brainwas ... change.htm







Soviet Education under Lenin

Models U.S. Education for the New millennium



http://www.crossroad.to/charts/soviet-us-ed.htm









Similarities between

America’s Goals 2000 & UNESCO’s Education Plan,

“Towards a Conceptual Model of Life-long Education[i]



http://www.crossroad.to/charts/UNESCO-Goals2000.htm







Three Sets of Meanings for Educational Buzzwords

The same double-speak pervades the UN and all other parts of the new global management system



http://www.crossroad.to/charts/NewMeanings.html







Brainwashing & How to Resist It



http://www.crossroad.to/charts/brainwashing.html



Obama supports "Birth to 5" universal preschool.

http://www.barackobama.com/issues/pdf/P ... tSheet.pdf

Sorry, I don't want the government being in control of my children from
the time they are born.

[kazbo]

Abortion is a sin but the sin of fornication it took to get there is even worse for man's body per scriptures.

Even though sin is sin in G-ds eye and G-d said sexual sin is worse because of what it does to the body murder seems to the be defining factor for most.

What scripture are you alluding to that says sexual sin is worse than killing babies?

[I've Seen Angels]

When we stand before the Lord we will not be able to hide the truth...When He asks "Did you care for My children?" Remember He will not only be talking abut the born but the unborn....we will be held accountable for our votes ...you can't hide from God your actions...........also if you did take note last night....neither candidate would say that they would come to Israel's rescue if they were attacked by Iran...........Our nation is no longer a nation of God but a selfish nation who would put a man with fancy talk in the White House without weighing him the balances of what is right and wrong.We have an obligation to be Christians regardless of what our race, creed or color.....neither man is perfect but there is one who actually has Christian values and one who can't even produce a legal birth certificate...please consider prayer before making that vote.....God first!

Gail

Right, McCain's "Christian values involve killing embryos, having an adulterous affair, and cussing out his colleagues. I guess killing embryos is okay with you then. So, if a woman gets rid of her embryo before a certain stage is it still abortion then? I mean...where do you think they get the embryos from?

I am not sure at this point why many on this board debate the issue. Unless you're a hypocrite, the standards to which many of you hold Obama would not allow you to vote for any candidate at this rate.

Is it that it is easier to jump on the murder ban wagon? Even though sin is sin in G-ds eye and G-d said sexual sin is worse because of what it does to the body murder seems to the be defining factor for most. I guess murder would be easier to rally against considering that most have not murdered but for fornication....let's just say the numbers are higher.

Now you are just angry and throwing out words ...vote however you feel God is leading you but for me I will support McCain....the lesser of two evils in my opinion...and I am laughing right now about the racist comment....the man's mother was not African American....the color of his skin shouldn't even be an issue except to those who have to defend their stand and feel the need to slur others to get across a point...regardless I am a republican and I am far from liberal....I guess that really puts me on your bad list....and by the way I am female...now there is something that is considered really bad in today's political race!

Gail

[D4Christ]

D3Christ wrote;

Is this a Christian board....really? Have you seen the outrageous assumptions about Obama or do you just think that every horrid thing that is written on this board about him is true because he doesn't look like you?

Do they train all Obama supporters to play the race card? It seems to be a tactic employed when presented with the truth. In my posts on this board, I presented you with articles that quoted what came out of the man`s own mouth. If the truth is considered outrageous assumptions by you, so be it. But you have absolutely no reason to assume or insinuate that I am a racsist. I`m your sister in Christ, and you have no good reason to slur me like that. You obviously don`t want the truth no matter what, so to each there own. You really ought to take a chill pill.

YSIC,
Brenda

You called yourself a hick not me. If you think you are a racists (you would have plenty of company) then you should go to G-d in prayer and repent. Otherwise you can take it down a notch. Since when can't I express my opinion on FP?

McCain's new stragegy is not a secret...he is using fear that Obama does not look like, talk like or associate with people that most "good" Amerians do. And the, Obama is a murderer, foreigner, how'd he pay to go to school rhetoric on this board is more of the McSame.

If I wanted to slur you it would have been a done deal. Do I write like I am at a lost for words? I just happen to have a different opinion, which has caused some people on this thread to freak out. I want to know the truth and I believe that I have found it. You don't want me to chill...you want me to bow out to the pressure of everyone else's opinion and shut up. Aint happening, my sister.

We are free to disagree but please do put words in my mouth. I can speak on my own and G-d willing will be around for a while to continue doing so.

YSIC,
Deirdre

[D4Christ]

Now you are just angry and throwing out words ...vote however you feel God is leading you but for me I will support McCain....the lesser of two evils in my opinion...and I am laughing right now about the racist comment....the man's mother was not African American....the color of his skin shouldn't even be an issue except to those who have to defend their stand and feel the need to slur others to get across a point...regardless I am a republican and I am far from liberal....I guess that really puts me on your bad list....and by the way I am female...now there is something that is considered really bad in today's political race!

Gail

Angry...no, absolutely not. But which words did I just throw out...the ones about McCain? Oh, there couldn't possibly be anyting wrong with your candidate of choice could it? And yet choice is my point. I will vote for whom I want just like I am sure you will. I have never said any different.

And if you consider me saying Obama does not look like you, means I am calling you a racist then you are taking the comment out of context. I said that in relation to the new tactics being used by McCains campaign. I NEVER called you a racist and I am suprised to find you playing the race card. I dont know what to think about that. In my experience I have found that those who yell, 'I am not a racist' the loudest ususally are. I hope that is not true but in any case I really don't care. I was talking about an election and could care less about your political party affiliation, race or sex.

I am just talking issues. But I hope you understand that I will not be a bobble head and nod yes to the majority opinion just because everyone else is.

[I've Seen Angels]

D3Christ wrote;

Is this a Christian board....really? Have you seen the outrageous assumptions about Obama or do you just think that every horrid thing that is written on this board about him is true because he doesn't look like you?

Do they train all Obama supporters to play the race card? It seems to be a tactic employed when presented with the truth. In my posts on this board, I presented you with articles that quoted what came out of the man`s own mouth. If the truth is considered outrageous assumptions by you, so be it. But you have absolutely no reason to assume or insinuate that I am a racsist. I`m your sister in Christ, and you have no good reason to slur me like that. You obviously don`t want the truth no matter what, so to each there own. You really ought to take a chill pill.

YSIC,
Brenda

You called yourself a hick not me. If you think you are a racists (you would have plenty of company) then you should go to G-d in prayer and repent. Otherwise you can take it down a notch. Since when can't I express my opinion on FP?

McCain's new stragegy is not a secret...he is using fear that Obama does not look like, talk like or associate with people that most "good" Amerians do. And the, Obama is a murderer, foreigner, how'd he pay to go to school rhetoric on this board is more of the McSame.

If I wanted to slur you it would have been a done deal. Do I write like I am at a lost for words? I just happen to have a different opinion, which has caused some people on this thread to freak out. I want to know the truth and I believe that I have found it. You don't want me to chill...you want me to bow out to the pressure of everyone else's opinion and shut up. Aint happening, my sister.

We are free to disagree but please do put words in my mouth. I can speak on my own and G-d willing will be around for a while to continue doing so.

YSIC,
Deirdre

I believe his socialistic agenda should be all that should convince us of what his term will look like...More government control....and more taxes for the middle class but there are those, I believe 45 percent who don't even pay taxes . they will actually benefit from his rob from the rich and give to the poor theology...and fines for those companies who don't give their employees insurance....except for the small business but he will not define who they are... a 400 billion dollar increase in spending that he will not tell us how he is going to get the money to pay for it...but that will be a surprise when he is elected, if elected.If most notice he does not give a direct answer when asked, he is such a master of words that he avoids answers to serious questions.When the biggest liberals on television support the man and is treating him like the second messiah you have to start asking yourself...."What is it that is so appealing to the people who would be affected the most from Obama's take from the rich and give to the poor idea" Something is very fishy! My mother always said..."If it walks like a duck and talks like a duck, then it must be a duck."


Gail

[Finaldash]

Wow!! This thread has taken the turn for the worst. Nothing is being accomplished here.
Have you guys forgotten who we are?

[D4Christ]

Abortion is a sin but the sin of fornication it took to get there is even worse for man's body per scriptures.

Even though sin is sin in G-ds eye and G-d said sexual sin is worse because of what it does to the body murder seems to the be defining factor for most.

What scripture are you alluding to that says sexual sin is worse than killing babies?

1 Corinthians 5

1 I can hardly believe the report about the sexual immorality going on among you—something that even pagans don’t do. I am told that a man in your church is living in sin with his stepmother. 2 You are so proud of yourselves, but you should be mourning in sorrow and shame. And you should remove this man from your fellowship.
3 Even though I am not with you in person, I am with you in the Spirit. And as though I were there, I have already passed judgment on this man 4 in the name of the Lord Jesus. You must call a meeting of the church. I will be present with you in spirit, and so will the power of our Lord Jesus. 5 Then you must throw this man out and hand him over to Satan so that his sinful nature will be destroyed and he himself will be saved on the day the Lord returns.

6 Your boasting about this is terrible. Don’t you realize that this sin is like a little yeast that spreads through the whole batch of dough? 7 Get rid of the old “yeast” by removing this wicked person from among you. Then you will be like a fresh batch of dough made without yeast, which is what you really are. Christ, our Passover Lamb, has been sacrificed for us. 8 So let us celebrate the festival, not with the old bread of wickedness and evil, but with the new bread of sincerity and truth.

9 When I wrote to you before, I told you not to associate with people who indulge in sexual sin. 10 But I wasn’t talking about unbelievers who indulge in sexual sin, or are greedy, or cheat people, or worship idols. You would have to leave this world to avoid people like that. 11 I meant that you are not to associate with anyone who claims to be a believer yet indulges in sexual sin, or is greedy, or worships idols, or is abusive, or is a drunkard, or cheats people. Don’t even eat with such people.

12 It isn’t my responsibility to judge outsiders, but it certainly is your responsibility to judge those inside the church who are sinning. 13 God will judge those on the outside; but as the Scriptures say, “You must remove the evil person from among you.”

1 Corinthians 6

9 Don’t you realize that those who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God? Don’t fool yourselves. Those who indulge in sexual sin, or who worship idols, or commit adultery, or are male prostitutes, or practice homosexuality, 10 or are thieves, or greedy people, or drunkards, or are abusive, or cheat people—none of these will inherit the Kingdom of God. 11 Some of you were once like that. But you were cleansed; you were made holy; you were made right with God by calling on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

12 You say, “I am allowed to do anything”—but not everything is good for you. And even though “I am allowed to do anything,” I must not become a slave to anything. 13 You say, “Food was made for the stomach, and the stomach for food.” (This is true, though someday God will do away with both of them.) But you can’t say that our bodies were made for sexual immorality. They were made for the Lord, and the Lord cares about our bodies. 14 And God will raise us from the dead by his power, just as he raised our Lord from the dead.
15 Don’t you realize that your bodies are actually parts of Christ? Should a man take his body, which is part of Christ, and join it to a prostitute? Never! 16 And don’t you realize that if a man joins himself to a prostitute, he becomes one body with her? For the Scriptures say, “The two are united into one.”[d] 17 But the person who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with him.
18 Run from sexual sin! No other sin so clearly affects the body as this one does. For sexual immorality is a sin against your own body. 19 Don’t you realize that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit, who lives in you and was given to you by God? You do not belong to yourself, 20 for God bought you with a high price. So you must honor God with your body.

I have said that sexual sin is worse for the body per the scriptures. G-d does not say murder is any worse than any of the other sins he warns us of. Sin is sin and I do not think one accounts for more of his wrath than another. G-d put the list out and at the top though was not murder...it was worshipping false gods.

[D4Christ]

[You really need to be careful who you are calling racist....what if I am black....can you tell by the color of my words on a screen....You really need to be careful.
Gail

Now, who needs to chill. This is outrageous. Support McCain and be 'amened' all the way to the polls. Support Obama and be ridiculed, have your vote called murderous and be accused of calling someone a racist??? I have not called anyone a racist and I did not bring color up. I think Stevie Wonder could see I made that point clear.

No, I do not need to be so carfeul. Maybe you shouldn't jump the gun. I could care less about your color.

I thought this was a discussion board. I did not know it was being patroled by the thought police.

Gail, I think you and I should agree to disagree because you definitely don't know what color I am and I would hate to have this lively thread stopped due to nonsense.

[I've Seen Angels]

Just thought I'd share...

Blessings,
From The Old Timer

Author unknown

This election has me very worried. So many things to consider. About a year ago I would have voted for Obama. I have changed my mind three times since than. I watch all the news channels, jumping from one to another. I must say this drives my husband crazy. But, I feel if you view _http://www.msnbc.msn.com/_ (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/) MSNBC, CNN, and _http://www.foxnews.com/_ (http://www.foxnews.com/) Fox News, you might get some middle ground to work with.



About six months ago, I started thinking "where did the money come from for Obama". I have four daughters who went to College, and we were middle class, and money was tight. We (including my girls) worked hard and there were lots of student loans. I started looking into Obama's life. Around 1979 Obama started college at Occidental in California. He is very open about his two years at Occidental, he tried all kinds of drugs and was wasting his time but, even though he had a brilliant mind, did not apply himself to his studies. "Barry" (that was the name he used all his life) during this time had two roommates, Muhammad Hasan Chandoo and Wahid Hamid, both from Pakistan. During the summer of 1981, after his second year in college, he made a "round the world" trip. Stopping to see his mother in Indonesia, next Hyderabad in India, three weeks in Karachi, Pakistan where he stayed with his roommate's family, then off to Africa to visit his father's family.



My question - Where did he get the money for this trip? Neither I, nor any one of my children would have had money for a trip like this when they where in college. When he came back he started school at Columbia University in New York. It is at this time he wants everyone to call him Barack - not Barry. Do you know what the tuition is at Columbia? It's not cheap to say the least. Where did he get money for tuition? Student Loans? Maybe.



After Columbia, he went to Chicago to work as a Community Organizer for $12,000. a year. Why Chicago? Why not New York? He was already living in New York. By "chance" he met Antoin "Tony" Rezko, born in Aleppo, Syria, and a real estate developer in Chicago. Rezko has been convicted of fraud and bribery this year. Rezko, was named "Entrepreneur of the Decade" by the Arab-American Business and Professional Association".



About two years later, Obama entered Harvard Law School. Do you have any idea what tuition is for Harvard Law School? Where did he get the money for Law School? More student loans?



After Law school, he went back to Chicago. Rezko offered him a job, which he turned down. But, he did take a job with Davis, Miner, Barnhill & Galland. Guess what? They represented "Rezar" which Rezko's firm. Rezko was one of Obama's first major financial contributors when he ran for office in Chicago. In 2003, Rezko threw an early fundraiser for Obama which Chicago Tribune reporter David Mendelland claims was instrumental in providing Obama with "seed money" for his U.S. Senate race. In 2005, Obama purchased a new home in Kenwoood District of Chicago for $1.65 million (less than asking price).



With ALL those Student Loans - Where did he get the money for the property? On the same day Rezko's wife, Rita, purchased the adjoining empty lot for full price. The London Times reported that Nadhmi Auchi, an Iraqi-born billionaire, loaned Rezko $3.5 million three weeks before Obama's new home was purchased. Obama met Nadhmi Auchi many times with Rezko. Now, we have Obama running for President.



Valerie Jarrett was Michele Obama's boss. She is now Obama's chief advisor and he does not make any major decisions without talking to her first. Where was Jarrett born? Ready for this? Shiraz, Iran! Do we see a pattern here? Or am I going crazy? On May 10, 2008 The Times reported, Robert Malley advisor to Obama was "sacked" after the press found out he was having regular contacts with "Hamas", which controls Gaza and is connected with Iran.



This past week, buried in the back part of the papers, Iraqi newspapers reported that during Obama's visit to Iraq, he asked their leaders to do nothing about the war until after he is elected, and he will "Take care of things".



Oh, and by the way, remember the college roommates that where born in Pakistan? They are in charge of all those "small" Internet campaign contribution for Obama. Where is that money coming from? The poor and middle class in this country? Or could it be from the Middle East. And the final bit of news. On September 7, 2008, The Washington Times posted a verbal slip that was made on "This Week" with George Stephanapoulos. Obama on talking about his religion said, "My Muslim faith". When questioned, "he make a mistake". Some mistake! All of the above information I got on line. If you would like to check it - Wikipedia, encyclopedia, Barack Obama; Tony Rezko; Valerie Jarrett: Daily Times - Obama visited Pakistan in 1981; The Washington Times - September 7, 2008; The Times May 10, 2008. Now the BIG question - If I found out all this information on my own, Why haven't all of our "intelligent" members of the press been reporting this?



A phrase that keeps ringing in my ear - "Beware of the enemy from within"!!!

This is a very good post and very enlightening!!! I will share it with my husband and friends. Thank you again
Gail

[I've Seen Angels]

[You really need to be careful who you are calling racist....what if I am black....can you tell by the color of my words on a screen....You really need to be careful.
Gail

Gail, I think you and I should agree to disagree because you definitely don't know what color I am and I would hate to have this lively thread stopped due to nonsense.

You are so right but I deleted this quote but you decided to put here anyways...not me...I had prayer about it and felt it was not a christian thing to address you about your racist comments....leave me out of your war of eloquent words....consider me off limits in your threads please....thank you!

Gail

[Swayde]

I can't see how any Christians can vote for Obama, or McCain. They are both liars, both professional politicians, both are puppets of someone who I get the feeling does not have good intentions for our nation. I do find it harder to swallow the support of Obama by Christians. The party alone supports way too many unbiblical things, but McCain is really not any better. They are both very liberal and very pro-government. I am very disappointed that so many Christians are so heavily onboard either of these two candidates. I can't believe more aren't supporting Chuck Baldwin =/ It's disheartening that people are playing politics like it's chess or something...well if we just vote for this guy, it blocks this guy and then we can do this move here, and so on....no thanks.

[Abiding in His Word]

and I would hate to have this lively thread stopped due to nonsense.

pretty close to that point folks.....

[D4Christ]

[You really need to be careful who you are calling racist....what if I am black....can you tell by the color of my words on a screen....You really need to be careful.
Gail

Gail, I think you and I should agree to disagree because you definitely don't know what color I am and I would hate to have this lively thread stopped due to nonsense.

You are so right but I deleted this quote but you decided to put here anyways...not me...I had prayer about it and felt it was not a christian thing to address you about your racist comments....leave me out of your war of eloquent words....consider me off limits in your threads please....thank you!

Gail

Agreed. You playing the race card is not what I'm about so the feeling is mutual. We never have to address one another again. Thanks!

[Abiding in His Word]

As much as it is possible, live in peace with everyone. Rom 12:18