Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

News about humankind's turning from God.

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby keithareilly on Tue Jun 09, 2015 11:04 am

OK,

A couple of thoughts.

I am not convinced there has been an explosion of child sex crimes. An explosion in disclosure certainly, but not certain the crime has increased. What I think is that these have been going on for years just not exposed through national and global media. The bringing of these to light in the media makes them appear common place and people get used to the idea they happen and they become nothing out of the ordinary. Homosexuality is an example.

As a consequence of people being taught same sex preference is acceptable, we will see an increase in the legalization of immorality and therefore the acceptability of immorality. If you doubt this ask yourself how many abortions are performed for the purpose of birth control instead of health issues since the legalization of abortion. Abortion enables fornication by eliminating the consequences such as pregnancy and responsibility for raising ones child. While I am a proponent of abortion, I realize the negative (and positive) consequences upon society.

The illegalization of discrimination based upon sexual preference means one cannot legally deny a child molester a job driving a school bus. The idea that we are all equal, which we are in the eyes of God, does not mean that our actions are equal in the eyes of God. Nevertheless, as we ascribe slavery to sin, such as homosexuality, to genetic or social upbringing, that is, inherent to who they are, instead of what it is, a situation, that is, slavery to sin, we release the individuals in society from the responsibility for their behavior. After all, how can we blame a scorpion for stinging its prey?

So, what we are witnessing is an acceptance to slavery to sin as inherent in who we are instead of the situation we are in and enslavement to sin as the inescapable normal for all men, therefore, who can blame anyone for what they do when that is who they are?

Keith
Last edited by keithareilly on Tue Jun 09, 2015 3:17 pm, edited 3 times in total.
keithareilly
Supporting Member
 
Posts: 1674
Joined: Mon Mar 13, 2006 2:48 pm
Location: Mineral Bluff, GA

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby GodsStudent on Tue Jun 09, 2015 3:10 pm

Again, Abiding, well said.

Anyone want to take issue with God? Rake Him over the coals for having standards and drawing a REAL LINE between right and wrong, good and bad, acceptable and unacceptable....oh, I forgot, a whole lot of people do.

Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God" (1 Corinthians 6:9-11).

Oh what slippery slopes we all like to go down in the name of "individualism." Sure, Josh can be forgiven....but I will never defend him on any level for what he did and it's sad that his victims see him as a victim now. Just sad.....right speak is out the window on this and so many other things. Sad.
GodsStudent
Supporting Member
 
Posts: 10994
Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2008 10:36 pm

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby burien1 on Tue Jun 09, 2015 6:52 pm

GodsStudent wrote:

Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God" (1 Corinthians 6:9-11).



Your above quote says 1 Corinthians 6:9-11, but it is missing 11.11 And such were some of you. But ye are washed, ye are sanctified, ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God. :wink:
Psalm 119:105; Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
User avatar
burien1
MODERATOR
 
Posts: 8464
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2007 7:57 pm

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby ampersand on Tue Jun 09, 2015 10:17 pm

Exit40 wrote:Hi Ampersand. I think our disagreement stems from what I consider to be PTS, and what would be considered the actual defined 'disorder'. The misconceptions between the two, even in the professional field, are huge, and thus the misunderstandings which create the stigma's.
...
The stigma is caused by the misconceptions of the difference between PTS, and the 'disorder' itself that can result from not receiving proper timely treatment. I consider it to be a matter of perspectives, some of which cause judgmental reactions in untrained individuals.

Ok, I see. We were talking about two slightly different things. Honestly, I haven't heard of "PTS" as such. I would have to agree with you: it sure doesn't sound like a "disorder" the way you describe it. PTSD on the other hand is a well-defined diagnosis with a component of dysfunction that justifies the "disorder" suffix. Whatever the label, I agree it's a complex issue without a simple solution.
Are you involved with PTS professionally ?

I am a physician, but not a psychiatrist. What I have written about PTSD so far in this thread reflects the minimum competency that is expected of any licensed physician.

Regards,
&
ampersand
 
Posts: 501
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:52 am

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby ampersand on Tue Jun 09, 2015 10:17 pm

Abiding in His Word wrote:...
It was, and still is, my desire to explore the root cause, underlying belief systems, general family training and/or teachings, previous victimization, religious or spiritual foundations, or others that may cause a seeming explosion of sexual crimes........

I think the human heart is just as depraved as it ever was. However, there has been an explosion in wickedness of all kinds. I'm not sure that sexual sin is unique in its growth. I can't think of a single sin that has decreased in frequency over human history. In any case, while I can't explain the specific factors that Abiding in His Word mentioned, major contributions to the exponential rise in sexual sin have been availability, legalization and social acceptance of all kinds of deviousness. With massive growth in technology over the last century, people can put the most despicable kinds of things before their eyes with significantly less effort than previously. In fact, the "barriers to entry" are nonexistent. Couple that with persistent widespread legalization of sins that are specifically prohibited by Scripture (homosexuality, mass murder of unborn humans are two examples) and social acceptance of once-abhorrent practices (like unscriptural divorce, for example), and we are destroying our very humanity at a frenetic pace.

Another aspect that I think about is just plain old population growth. Its a simplistic way of looking at things, but it does give some insight. In 0 AD, the world population was 170 million (1/2 the current population of the U.S). In 1900, it was 1.6 billion. By 1969, 3.6 billion. 45 years later in 2015, it has doubled to 7.2 billion. If you keep all other things constant, that kind of increase in wicked hearts would account for a staggering increase in wickedness. While the wickedness of the human heart is a constant I think, other factors as mentioned above have not remained constant. By continuously feeding our wicked appetites, we have created hunger for more and more evil.

Now, 40 million unborn humans are murdered per year worldwide; 110,000/day. This number is reportedly declining. (BTW, that's how many people were killed instantly on August 6th and 9th, 1945, when atomic bombs were dropped over Hiroshima and Nagasaki...we are killing two 1945-atomic bombs' worth of babies every day). 85,000 humans are raped per year in the United States; 230/day. Other statistics are equally depressing. We are destroying humanity, quantitatively and qualitatively, at an alarming rate, with no end in sight but the coming of our Lord.

The Apostle Paul wrote to Timothy:
1 But understand this, that in the last days there will come times of difficulty. 2 For people will be lovers of self, lovers of money, proud, arrogant, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, 3 heartless, unappeasable, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not loving good,4 treacherous, reckless, swollen with conceit, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God, 5 having the appearance of godliness, but denying its power.

What he have are multitudes of people who have denied the true power of godliness, but have maintained the outward appearance of propriety, all while succumbing to the darkest desires of sinful flesh. This outward godliness is further enabled by widespread legalization of those things that were in recent history criminal.

However, there is an end in sight!
Revelation 22:20 wrote:He who testifies to these things says, “Surely I am coming soon.”Amen. Come, Lord Jesus!


in Christ,
&
ampersand
 
Posts: 501
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:52 am

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby GodsStudent on Wed Jun 10, 2015 4:01 am

burien1 wrote:
GodsStudent wrote:

Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God" (1 Corinthians 6:9-11).



Your above quote says 1 Corinthians 6:9-11, but it is missing 11.11 And such were some of you. But ye are washed, ye are sanctified, ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God. :wink:


Sorry, cut and pasted from the internet.....didn't realize 11 was indicated, but not reproduced.
GodsStudent
Supporting Member
 
Posts: 10994
Joined: Sun Mar 16, 2008 10:36 pm

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby keithareilly on Wed Jun 10, 2015 8:22 am

Ampersand wrote,
...having the appearance of godliness, but denying its power


Reading further we have ..
2 Timothy 3:5-7English Standard Version (ESV)
5 having the appearance of godliness, but denying its power. Avoid such people. 6 For among them are those who creep into households and capture weak women, burdened with sins and led astray by various passions, 7 always learning and never able to arrive at a knowledge of the truth.

Knowledge of the truth and the power of godliness are key to changing society. The lack of knowledge and the denying of the power of godliness are sources of immorality in todays society. Christians are viewed in society as ignorant, believers in superstition and myth. The power we exert in society to implement significant changes through politics is described as the "war on women", "hate speech", and "intolerance". We are sidelined by trying to overcome these labels by loving the sinner not the sin. When a person stands up for what is right, his past is searched and sins revealed to the public for the purpose of discounting his stance through hierocracy, his power to make change thus cancelled.

What is the power of godliness? To shed light in darkness, to free us from enslavement to sin, the renewing of the mind, such that a homosexual or child molester is no longer such on the inside so that the outside may be clean also. One a homosexual (child molester [or substitute your own sin]) always a homosexual is a lie. We don't have to be who we used to be.

Those who love sin have no desire to change and seek to create darkness (lack of knowledge) in which they can thrive and there actions be approved. This is accomplished by calling evil good and good evil. Hence, abortion is not about killing the unborn it is about women's rights, homosexuality is not about immorality, it is about equality and justice. The labeling of evil good and good evil are key elements to furthering en environment where sin may thrive.

Sin is living thing and it seeks to create an environment where it can thrive. Imagine a science fiction film where this living thing called Sin enters the world through Adam, seeks to deceives humans constantly thereby enslaving them to do its will, and through them creating a world of darkness and where it may reproduce, creating more sin. I think we as Christian fail to personify Sin. Consequently, we don't recognize its power and how to fight it in society. For example, Bill Clinton advocated his personal life was not public business during the Monica Lewinski affair. What was this really? It was Sin trying to keep itself from being brought into the light so that it might thrive. Many people bought into this argument. In so doing they promote an environment where Sin may thrive. Scripture says all the towns people should participate in the stoning of the wicked. Why? because opposing Sin is public business. We don't believe that anymore. Individual rights trump morality.

Keith
keithareilly
Supporting Member
 
Posts: 1674
Joined: Mon Mar 13, 2006 2:48 pm
Location: Mineral Bluff, GA

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby imirish01 on Mon Jun 15, 2015 11:12 pm

If I might chime in for a moment- these things I know from training and experience...

1. Teenage boys can and sometimes do touch younger children in a sexual way. The boys are often immature and are seeking to know sexual things about the opposite, or same, sex. They will touch and asked to be touched. They can just touch one victim or possibly touch, molest, many victims. The more the victims, the more serious the crime is. One victim is bad enough, but multiple victims raises a big red flag!

2. The families that have to deal with the boys that touch are devastated because of what has occurred. The boy is often taken out of the home and the victim's are left knowing that their telling on their family member caused major disruption.

3. Counseling is often ordered for the juvenile offender, Josh Duggar for example. Jail time helps to add to the seriousness of the case and to further get the juvenile offenders attention. See #6 below for further.

4. A family that hires an attorney for the juvenile offender is suspicious, yet not out of line. The offender's legal rights have to be met.

5. The younger the juvenile offender, 12-14 the more likely you are not dealing with an up and coming serial offender. Again, look at their maturity level and go from there. These case are best handled by attorneys and law enforcement officers who know how to work a sexual offender case. Hiding the ball by keeping law enforcment out of the investigation is likely a poor decision.

6. The big question not asked, "Is this learned behavior?" A good forensic interview with Josh would have fleshed this out.

But the main point I want to make is- This police report should have NEVER, EVER have been made public and published on the web. It was a juvenile suspect and juvenile victims! The general public does not need to be made aware of what happened to those girls. The report was meant to shame Josh but trampled those girls! What they wanted was never considered. They were victims of crimes and they were never consulted a out the report going poi lid, which as far as I lnow is illegal. Especially if their names were not blacked out!!! All of them!

I know we are currently in a society that states they want to judge the facts of what the media brings to the dinner table. But, honestly, the general public is not trained to review these facts. They do not know the law and are not familiar with who commits these types of crimes or why they are committed. It is not dinner table fodder! If your want to know about these case, go through law school, go through the police academy, dispatcher training or whatever to get some understanding. But for heavens sake, don't listen to Fox or CNN when they start asking questions about why "we" don't know something.

If your were raped would you want it broadcast for all the world to see? Would you want a reporter asking if what you said was true? Breaking down the very limited information, they have no idea what they are talking about and they hire "experts" to provide opinions on limited information. The news is ruining society and I certainly don't want to participate.

Lastly, PTSD is currently being refered to in the professional realm as PTS-I (injury). Really new language but more accurately describes what has occurred. The injury is an emotional injury that can (maybe not fully) be healed. It just takes time and counseling. DSM-V still states it is a disorder, but the language is changing. Our good doctor can diagnose PTSD via the DSM-V.
imirish01
 
Posts: 842
Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 10:55 am

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby Abiding in His Word on Tue Jun 16, 2015 4:57 am

The general public does not need to be made aware of what happened to those girls. The report was meant to shame Josh but trampled those girls!


If your were raped would you want it broadcast for all the world to see? Would you want a reporter asking if what you said was true?


imirish01, I must strongly disagree with this type of thinking. I know it's the prevalent, popular attitude, but it does nothing but validate the shame in the eyes of the victim. Victims of sexual assault, male or female, must be encouraged to speak out against the crime committed against them. They must be told it will most likely be embarrassing, but at the same time courageous and important in doing their part in stopping further assaults against others and that you will stand by for support. They have done nothing to warrant an assault but must also be prepared that, in an effort to shift the blame, questions will be asked for that purpose. For example, what was she wearing, where was she at 2 a.m., was she drinking alcohol, was she acting flirtatious, etc. These are societies "second assaults" and used (often successfully) to shift the blame from the perpetrator to the victim.

I will post the absurdity of victim blaming techniques in the next post due to it's length. You will clearly see how this line of thinking is directed to victims of sexual assault and how ridiculous it is when applied to a different type of crime victim.

Victims of sexual assault do not ask in any way to be assaulted and constantly encouraging them to hide rather than come out courageously, gives perpetrators incentive to continue with other victims.

See how serious God sees sexual assault:

Deu 22:25 "But if in the field the man finds the girl who is engaged, and the man forces her and lies with her, then only the man who lies with her shall die.
Deu 22:26 "But you shall do nothing to the girl; there is no sin in the girl worthy of death, for just as a man rises against his neighbor and murders him, so is this case.
Deu 22:27 "When he found her in the field, the engaged girl cried out, but there was no one to save her.


Deu 22:25 "But if in the field the man finds the girl who is engaged, and the man forces her and lies with her, then only the man who lies with her shall die.
Deu 22:26 "But you shall do nothing to the girl; there is no sin in the girl worthy of death, for just as a man rises against his neighbor and murders him, so is this case.


Teenage boys can and sometimes do touch younger children in a sexual way. The boys are often immature and are seeking to know sexual things about the opposite, or same, sex.


This is the same rationalization used by the Duggars to minimize his crimes against 5 young girls. I'm concerned about this type of thinking whether or not it's used by professionals or not. I think there's deeper problems or familial conditions that influence a young teenager to engage in such actions under devious circumstances. The fact that it's done at night when the victims were asleep is evidence he knows it's not a day-time, wide-awake, appropriate thing to do as it would obviously have a different result.

See a "victim blaming" comparison next.
User avatar
Abiding in His Word
SITE ADMIN
 
Posts: 28618
Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 4:54 pm
Location: SW Florida

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby Abiding in His Word on Tue Jun 16, 2015 5:00 am

The law discriminates against rape victims in a manner which would not be tolerated by victims of any other crime. In the following example, a holdup victim is asked questions similar in form to those usually asked a victim of rape.

Mr. Smith gets robbed

“Mr. Smith, you were held up at gunpoint on the corner of 16th and Locust?”

“Yes.”

“Did you struggle with the robber?”

“No.”

“Why not?”

“He was armed.”

“Then you made a conscious decision to comply with his demands rather than to resist?”

“Yes.”

“Did you scream? Cry out?”

“No. I was afraid.”

“I see. Have you ever been held up before?”

“No.”

“Have you ever given money away?”

“Yes, of course–”

“And did you do so willingly?”

“What are you getting at?”

“Well, let’s put it like this, Mr. Smith. You’ve given away money in the past–in fact, you have quite a reputation for philanthropy. How can we be sure that you weren’t contriving to have your money taken from you by force?”

“Listen, if I wanted–”

“Never mind. What time did this holdup take place, Mr. Smith?”

“About 11 p.m.”

“You were out on the streets at 11 p.m.? Doing what?”

“Just walking.”

“Just walking? You know it’s dangerous being out on the street that late at night. Weren’t you aware that you could have been held up?”

“I hadn’t thought about it.”

“What were you wearing at the time, Mr. Smith?”

“Let’s see. A suit. Yes, a suit.”

“An expensive suit?”

“Well–yes.”

“In other words, Mr. Smith, you were walking around the streets late at night in a suit that practically advertised the fact that you might be a good target for some easy money, isn’t that so? I mean, if we didn’t know better, Mr. Smith, we might even think you were asking for this to happen, mightn’t we?”

“Look, can’t we talkin about the past history of the guy who did this to me?”

“I’m afraid not, Mr. Smith. I don’t think you would want to violate his rights, now, would you?”
User avatar
Abiding in His Word
SITE ADMIN
 
Posts: 28618
Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 4:54 pm
Location: SW Florida

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby Exit40 on Tue Jun 16, 2015 6:39 am

imirish01 wrote:Lastly, PTSD is currently being refered to in the professional realm as PTS-I (injury). Really new language but more accurately describes what has occurred. The injury is an emotional injury that can (maybe not fully) be healed. It just takes time and counseling. DSM-V still states it is a disorder, but the language is changing. Our good doctor can diagnose PTSD via the DSM-V.


Excellent.

God Bless You

David
Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God

T'was Grace that taught my heart to fear.
And Grace, my fears relieved.
How precious did that Grace appear
The hour I first believed.
User avatar
Exit40
Supporting Member
 
Posts: 8850
Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 6:46 am

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby imirish01 on Tue Jun 16, 2015 8:50 am

Abiding,

I agree that the victims of sexual assault should be encouraged to speak up for many different reasons. To stop the offender, to get help, get rid of the shame involved. Pretty sure we would be in agreement on these and others. The only caveat I would add to that is that the victim has a right not to go forward. They should be encouraged, by fully explaining he process, giving them faith in the detective or the D.A.s Office and support through Victim-Witness. However, if they choose not to, their wishes should then be honored. If not, they are again being victimized by, "No does not mean no." There have only been a few times that I could not work with a victim to hit the stand. Just a few...and I had to let their decision stand. I don't like it, but it is the law and morally I cannot make myself make them testify.

Yet, publishing a police report is not part of victims needing to speak up. Especially a police report regarding a sexual assault and even more so involving two or more, juveniles. Do you thinks police reports on sexual assaults should be made public? After adjudication...
imirish01
 
Posts: 842
Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 10:55 am

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby Abiding in His Word on Tue Jun 16, 2015 9:29 am

imirish01 wrote:However, if they choose not to, their wishes should then be honored. If not, they are again being victimized by, "No does not mean no." There have only been a few times that I could not work with a victim to hit the stand. Just a few...and I had to let their decision stand. I don't like it, but it is the law and morally I cannot make myself make them testify.


Florida does not accept a victim of dv's refusal to prosecute, but it becomes the state against the batterer in that situation. It's been a number of years but I have no reason to believe that's changed.

In another thread, I posted a horrific finding in Detroit warehouse of 11,000 sexual assault kits with some dated over 30 yrs. ago. Somethings very wrong with the system when assaults are treated with a ho-hum attitude by anyone.

Your comment about victims who may not wish to report may reflect the very point I made about the shame that's attributed to the very one who was violated. It's kind of a "myth" that's been perpetuated to the extent it has been erroneously accepted by victims with little to no refutation by family and/or friends.

Could not a victim identify the perpetrator via a line-up or photo id or witness statement with blurring of the face? That would be considered evidence at a trial, wouldn't it?

In other words, the legal system has a long way to go in the treatment of adult assault victims imo and we have a longer way to go in eradicating the misdirected shame from the victims.
User avatar
Abiding in His Word
SITE ADMIN
 
Posts: 28618
Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 4:54 pm
Location: SW Florida

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby imirish01 on Tue Jun 16, 2015 9:25 pm

DV victims can refuse to testify in CA. However, there is a court process they have to go through to get there.

I am talking about child molest Vic's who refuse to testify. They cannot be made to testify. Though, as I said, all efforts are made to try and address any issues they have prior to the case being dealt out or dismissed.

Are you saying there is a "myth" about shame? And that it is not properly addressed by family or friends due to family or friends lack of knowledge?

I know that I have only dealt with less than 20 cases where a victim flat out refused to testify in a child molest case. That is out of about 200 cases. So, 10%. Rape case are tough as well. Personally, along with the DDA, we can address their fears and walk them through the case. Knowledge is power and it helps alleviate their fears. This is not my first day or even year on the job and I try to act like I know what I am doing and address the pitfalls and fears upfront.

Regarding the rape kits, I don't have the full story as to why they were not processed. I do not believe a statement can be made that because of the backlog, it shows that law enforcement does not care about these cases. They do. Where and how the ball was dropped is for the Chief or Sheriff to address as he/she is ultimately responsible.

I know in CA, our DOJ has worked very hard to code out the rape kits they have been given. They are a blessing.
imirish01
 
Posts: 842
Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 10:55 am

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby imirish01 on Tue Jun 16, 2015 9:41 pm

The accused is afforded the right to confront the accuser. Thus, they have to sit in the same room as the Defendant. Now, in CA, if a Victim is under a certain age, I think under 11...they may testify via camera from another room. I have never seen it happen as we are normally able to get them into the courtroom. Reason being is that emotion is show on the stand that is lost via camera. The jury wants to see the Victim, face to face, To make a decision about someone elses freedom. They should be granted that opportunity and we should do everything in our power to "seek justice" for the Victim. It comes down to, I will get your ready for court, but you have to trust me! It will be hard, but we are going to do our best to seek justice for you because we believe you. I will walk you through this! The just need to know they are not alone and we walk with them. It helps I carry a gun when I walk. They are less afraid;).

So, no blurred faces at a prelim. And kids are not normally, if ever, called at a prelim. Rape victims can and are called, especially if we feel they may "go sideways" or have a history of drug or alcohol abuse. Thus, we need their testimony on record as soon as possible. And, they do surprisingly well considering. It always amazes me how strong people are under such great stress. And, after testimony is over, they tend to feel happy and relieved and stronger.

As a final reminder, these cases are far from black and white. A black and white case rarely, if ever, goes to trial. The gray ones do. The ones with little evidence beyond a "he said/she said." But, if we believe them, we will fight for them. And yes, people do lie. I won't get into that now. Too complicated.
imirish01
 
Posts: 842
Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 10:55 am

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby ampersand on Wed Jun 17, 2015 6:33 pm

Hi imirish01,

Thanks for your insight into these cases. Perhaps you mentioned it somewhere and I overlooked it, but could you describe what your involvement in these cases is? Are you a lawyer?

The reason I ask:
Just last week, I was involved with the diagnosis of two separate cases of child physical abuse. The extent of my involvement is to document injuries that are specific for non-accidental trauma and raise the suspicion for abuse; after I give this information to the pediatricians, it is out of my hands, and I usually don't know what happens after that. I wanted to know what usually happens after this; specifically: if the victim/victim's representative does not press charges, does the state usually move ahead with a criminal case? Or are most sexual/physical abuse cases brought as a civil suit?

This distinction is interesting in this specific case, because the statute of limitations in Arkansas would have expired for a civil case by the time police were notified, but the criminal statute is longer. Therefore, if the state genuinely had evidence of a crime, it's my understanding that they could have proceeded with a criminal case against Josh Duggar. So, it's unclear why the conclusion in the police report was that the statute of limitations had run out, when in fact there would have been no statute of limitations at that time for criminally prosecuting Duggar.

Am I misunderstanding how this works?

Regards,
&
ampersand
 
Posts: 501
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:52 am

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby imirish01 on Wed Jun 17, 2015 10:59 pm

Not a lawyer, but worked as an investigator for 14 years at a District Attorney's Office. Responsible for investigating child molest for 9 years and adult sex crimes(over 14-15) for 5 years. Worked with attorneys (everyone has their cross to bear, they were mine;).

California tends to send a child abuse victim, that shows signs of abuse, physical or sexual, to a pediatric forensic exam with a trained pediatric forensic nurse. A pediatrician is not normally used as an expert unless they are specifically trained for signs of abuse. California has a specific form that is filled out when the exam is completed. Photographs are taken, DNA collected, if any, and possible signs of abuse are documented. It is very detailed and essential to the investigation and possible prosecution.

There is no "sentencing" advantage with Josh Duggar, in that he is over the age of 18. The juvenile justice system is designed to rehabilitate and he is beyond the age that the juvenile justice system has authority. In California, he could be charged as an adult depending on the crime. This crime normally would have been handled by court ordered counseling, depending on the severity of the abuse. Fondling vs. Force and threats. Yadda-yadda. If he threatened or forced his multiple victims, the cae would have been considered as an adult filing depending not the investigation and cooperation of the now older victims. If the vidtims are adults, and choose not to testify, bad news. These types of cases have many variables and it takes a full reading of the police report and reviewing the videos to get a full understanding of the case.

Again, this case never should have been published in the paper IMO. The general public does not understand these cases or how to interprete the evidence properly. And, the taped interviews are essential. It is foolish to try and come up with an opinion with only 1/2, at best, of the available evidence. Thus, the talking heads that like to get their face on TV have no business giving their "expert" opinion...on TV. If they limit their opinion to Arkansas law states...or, these cases typically are handled this way...I am cool with that.

The State presses charges. Neither the family or the victim can press charges. They can say they are willing to help in the prosecution, but the decision is with the DAs Office. We represent the People of the State. It actually takes pressure off the child knowing they are not the ones "prosecuting" the perp. They are only asked to tell the truth. They often feel a great relief knowing that.

I did not deal with civil suits in child abuse cases.
imirish01
 
Posts: 842
Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 10:55 am

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby Abiding in His Word on Thu Aug 20, 2015 11:14 am

OK, so now the sexual addiction saga continues...

Josh Duggar admits having an account on the Ashley Madison (cheaters) web site. He apologies for his hypocrisy on the family website. You can read his statement here

I think this is evidence that sometimes those who appear the most virtuous may not be. Sexual addictions in the area of children, porn, or adultery are becoming more and more prevalent and it seems the church is not exempt from this type of sin.

Very sad indeed....
User avatar
Abiding in His Word
SITE ADMIN
 
Posts: 28618
Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 4:54 pm
Location: SW Florida

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby Abiding in His Word on Thu Aug 20, 2015 12:06 pm

In case someone is unaware of what Ashley Madison is... (it's been all over the news), a simple search will reveal it's purpose:

Ashley Madison is the online personals & dating destination for casual encounters, married dating, discreet encounters and extramarital affairs.


:(

It was hacked and so no doubt the thousands of members will be exposed soon and I can't imagine the number of families that will be destroyed and humiliated by the publicity as will his wife and four children.

:(
User avatar
Abiding in His Word
SITE ADMIN
 
Posts: 28618
Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 4:54 pm
Location: SW Florida

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby mark s on Thu Aug 20, 2015 12:32 pm

The files appear to include account details and log-ins for some 32 million users
ειπεν αυτη ο ιησους εγω ειμι η αναστασις και η ζωη ο πιστευων εις εμε καν αποθανη ζησεται
. . . saying to her Jesus, I AM the resurrection and the life, the one believing into Me even dying shall live . . .
User avatar
mark s
MODERATOR
 
Posts: 12821
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:38 am
Location: Southern California, USA

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby Abiding in His Word on Thu Aug 20, 2015 2:29 pm

And like the marginalization of the child molestations, Josh's statement has been revised to "soften" his sin.

Original:
I have been the biggest hypocrite ever. While espousing faith and family values, I have secretly over the last several years been viewing pornography on the internet and this became a secret addiction and I became unfaithful to my wife.


Revision:
I have been the biggest hypocrite ever. While espousing faith and family values, I have been unfaithful to my wife.


Don't get me wrong...I don't think all the gory details need to be posted for the world to see. But once a statement, admission of guilt, and request for forgiveness is posted publicly, the change is noticeably an effort for some sort of marginalization that someone thinks it won't be noticed.

I understand the need for a time to get over the shock (for all his family) and a time for healing, but Josh's sin had already found him out so the heartfelt expression of his shame was better than the edited version imo.

I am also not unsympathetic with addictions of a sexual nature for two reasons. One...the world has clearly become saturated with sexual images and two...my own son has struggled with an addiction to porn for many years and the shame he feels worries me as it's definitely a heavy load of guilt for anyone to carry.

Prayers are in order for everyone involved. And therapeutic, professional help as well.
User avatar
Abiding in His Word
SITE ADMIN
 
Posts: 28618
Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 4:54 pm
Location: SW Florida

Re: Josh Duggar apologizes amid molestation allegations

Postby imirish01 on Fri Aug 21, 2015 10:50 am

I guess the thing I hope for the most is that Josh's heart is given to Jesus and he hides nothing from Him. Jesus knows all our sins. The ones we want to stay hidden. He wants all of us, all our heart, for He alone can heal and he alone can deliver. It is the Gospel made alive and life giving when we acknowledge our sins before Him. So, I pray Josh does that.

Abiding, always wonderful to hear your authentic voice and truth about you and your life. Such a tough sin to get away from. But God does deliver and heal.
imirish01
 
Posts: 842
Joined: Mon Sep 15, 2008 10:55 am

Previous

Return to Apostasy Watch

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest