OBAMACARE: RFID CHIP IMPLANT IN 36 MONTHS:

[benny balerio]

OBAMACARE: RFID CHIP IMPLANT IN 36 MONTHS:
MANDATORY 666-VERICHIP MEDICAL IMPLANT UNDER OBAMA HEALTHCARE



BOTH HOUSE AND SENATE HEALTH BILLS REQUIRE THE MICRO CHIPPING OF AMERICANS – 3/18/10

Required RFID implanted chip

Sec. 2521, Pg. 1000 – The government will establish a National Medical Device Registry. What does a National Medical Device Registry mean?

National Medical Device Registry from H.R. 3200 [Healthcare Bill], pages 1001-1008:

(g)(1) The Secretary shall establish a national medical device registry (in this subsection referred to as the ‘registry’) to facilitate analysis of postmarket safety and outcomes data on each device that— ‘‘(A) is or has been used in or on a patient; ‘‘(B)and is— ‘‘(i) a class III device; or ‘‘(ii) a class II device that is implantable, life-supporting, or life-sustaining.”

Then on page 1004 it describes what the term “data” means in paragraph 1,

section B:
‘‘(2) In this paragraph, the term ‘data’ refers to information respecting a device described in paragraph (1), including claims data, patient survey data, standardized analytic files that allow for the pooling and analysis of data from disparate data environments, electronic health records, and any other data deemed appropriate by the Secretary”

What exactly is a class II device that is implantable? Approved by the FDA, a class II implantable device is an “implantable radio frequency transponder system for patient identification and health information.” The purpose of a class II device is to collect data in medical patients such as “claims data, patient survey data, standardized analytic files that allow for the pooling and analysis of data from disparate data environments, electronic health records, and any other data deemed appropriate by the Secretary.”

See it for yourself: http://www.fda.gov/downloads/MedicalDev ... 072191.pdf

This new law – when fully implemented – provides the framework for making the United States the first nation in the world to require each and every one of its citizens to have implanted in them a radio-frequency identification (RFID) microchip for the purpose of controlling who is, or isn’t, allowed medical care in their country.

Don’t believe it? Look it up yourself. Healthcare Bill H.R. 3200: http://waysandmeans.house.gov/media/pdf ... 001xml.pdf

Pages 1001-1008 “National Medical Device Registry” section.

Page 1006 “to be enacted within 36 months upon passage”

Page 503 “… medical device surveillance”

Why would the government use the word “surveillance” when referring to citizens? The definition of “surveillance” is the monitoring of the behavior, activities, or other changing information, usually of people and often in a secret manner. The root of the word [French] means to “watch over.”

In theory, the intent to streamline healthcare and to eliminate fraud via “health chips” seems right. But, to have the world’s lone superpower (America, for now) mandate (page 1006) a device to be IMPLANTED is scary!


Microchiping included in Healthcare Bill?
http://www.dailypaul.com/node/105079

Coverage under Obamacare will require an implantable microchip?
http://current.com/news/90842279_covera ... rochip.htm


SOURCE: http://goldfuture.wordpress.com/2010/03 ... ans-31810/

[GodsStudent]

Yep. I just got the link from a friend in an email today. 36 months is a total of 3 years, so to be within that time period, it must be beginning sooner than later, and completed within 3 years.

Since I believe many Americans will not go for this, whether or not it be the MOB, I believe many troubled times are pressing down upon us.

[rainbow7]

[benny balerio]

Yep. I just got the link from a friend in an email today. 36 months is a total of 3 years, so to be within that time period, it must be beginning sooner than later, and completed within 3 years.

Since I believe many Americans will not go for this, whether or not it be the MOB, I believe many troubled times are pressing down upon us.

Even though it is in 36 months,....and if many take the chip under their skin,...it is not a sin unless one is required to denounce Jesus as Lord.
I would laugh at them if it got to that point

[Salty Skipper]

The first two links don't work. I honestly do not think that this is "it." Reason being, the government has been pushing to standardize medical records and create a data base. There was an interview on a talk radio program the other day with one of the directors of the hospitals in our state. There was a caller who called in, concerned that this data system was going to be used to force patients to get a chip. The director said that there are no such plans in the works. They are creating a data base to standardize records so that people, who tend to move around a lot these days, can be cared for in the most effecient manner possible. Since the first two links don't work, I can't research it for myself.

[benny balerio]

Obama is moving fast to socialism.

[benny balerio]

The first two links don't work. I honestly do not think that this is "it." Reason being, the government has been pushing to standardize medical records and create a data base. There was an interview on a talk radio program the other day with one of the directors of the hospitals in our state. There was a caller who called in, concerned that this data system was going to be used to force patients to get a chip. The director said that there are no such plans in the works. They are creating a data base to standardize records so that people, who tend to move around a lot these days, can be cared for in the most effecient manner possible. Since the first two links don't work, I can't research it for myself.

Try the Following ,..I straightened the first link out,...I'll work on the second link.

http://www.fda.gov/downloads/MedicalDev ... 072191.pdf

[Salty Skipper]

Thank you for repairing the first link, Benny. How do we know that these transponders are not associated with products such as prosthetics (joint replacements and the like), or things like pace-makers? I'm reading the document, but it's dated 2004. RFID is used on practically everything in the hospital these days and I know that sometimes deceased persons are identified by medical devices that they have used in their body, joint replacements and such.

[GodsStudent]

http://goldfuture.wordpress.com/2010/03 ... ans-31810/

Here's the link I got.

[Salty Skipper]

Links in the original post are working now. Thanks Benny!

[Salty Skipper]

After reading over the government bill, I'm almost 100% positive that this is talking about prosthetic devices that are used inside the body and requiring them to be "registered" with serial numbers and such. Most already are. I guess that they are trying to create a national registry for whatever reason of these devices.

Having said that, I'm not 100% sure, but almost. And, that's not to say that a required chip isn't coming in association with healthcare. I just don't think that this is "it."

[benny balerio]

After reading over the government bill, I'm almost 100% positive that this is talking about prosthetic devices that are used inside the body and requiring them to be "registered" with serial numbers and such. Most already are. I guess that they are trying to create a national registry for whatever reason of these devices.

Having said that, I'm not 100% sure, but almost. And, that's not to say that a required chip isn't coming in association with healthcare. I just don't think that this is "it."

I am going to have to disagree with your assessment.
The following suggests that they want to ensure that the chip does not migrate to other parts of the body once it has been injected into the human body.

D. Migration Testing of Implanted Transponder
We recommend that you conduct testing of the implanted transponder to demonstrate that the
transponder will not migrate after implantation.

[Salty Skipper]

After reading over the government bill, I'm almost 100% positive that this is talking about prosthetic devices that are used inside the body and requiring them to be "registered" with serial numbers and such. Most already are. I guess that they are trying to create a national registry for whatever reason of these devices.

Having said that, I'm not 100% sure, but almost. And, that's not to say that a required chip isn't coming in association with healthcare. I just don't think that this is "it."

I am going to have to disagree with your assessment.
The following suggests that they want to ensure that the chip does not migrate to other parts of the body once it has been injected into the human body.

D. Migration Testing of Implanted Transponder
We recommend that you conduct testing of the implanted transponder to demonstrate that the
transponder will not migrate after implantation.

Could you tell me what page of the bill that quote is from? Thanks in advance!

[benny balerio]

After reading over the government bill, I'm almost 100% positive that this is talking about prosthetic devices that are used inside the body and requiring them to be "registered" with serial numbers and such. Most already are. I guess that they are trying to create a national registry for whatever reason of these devices.

Having said that, I'm not 100% sure, but almost. And, that's not to say that a required chip isn't coming in association with healthcare. I just don't think that this is "it."

I am going to have to disagree with your assessment.
The following suggests that they want to ensure that the chip does not migrate to other parts of the body once it has been injected into the human body.

D. Migration Testing of Implanted Transponder
We recommend that you conduct testing of the implanted transponder to demonstrate that the
transponder will not migrate after implantation.

Yes Sir,!
Page 4....it even uses the word "BIOCOMPATABILITY"

http://www.fda.gov/downloads/MedicalDev ... 072191.pdf

Could you tell me what page of the bill that quote is from? Thanks in advance!

[Mr Baldy]

After reading over the government bill, I'm almost 100% positive that this is talking about prosthetic devices that are used inside the body and requiring them to be "registered" with serial numbers and such. Most already are. I guess that they are trying to create a national registry for whatever reason of these devices.

Having said that, I'm not 100% sure, but almost. And, that's not to say that a required chip isn't coming in association with healthcare. I just don't think that this is "it."

After reading this article, it appears as if this is a way to collect Patient Information, and not just keeping an account on prosthetic devices that have serial numbers.

I find this very scary.

For those who have been Watching, I guess it's no secret that Obama has been associated with possibly being the "Beast from the Earth"; AKA - "The False Prophet". We definitely don't know this to be the case, however I find it very interesting, to say the least; that this Health Care Bill has passed, and within it's pages it is requiring that folks be implanted with an RFID chip.

It is unknown what the Mark of the Beast will be exactly; however in reading Revelation 13:11-18 - it is the False Prophet who is responsible for causing ALL to receive the Mark of the Beast.

Revelation 13:11-18 reads:

The Beast from the Earth

11) Then I saw another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb and he spoke as a dragon.

12) He exercises all the authority of the first beast in his presence And he makes the earth and those who dwell in it to worship the first beast, whose fatal wound was healed.

13) He performs great signs, so that he even makes fire come down out of heaven to the earth in the presence of men.

14) And he deceives those who dwell on the earth because of the signs which it was given him to perform in the presence of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who had the wound of the sword and has come to life.

15) And it was given to him to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast would even speak and cause as many as do not worship the image of the beast to be killed.

16) And he causes all, the small and the great, and the rich and the poor, and the free men and the slaves, to be given a mark on their right hand or on their forehead,

17) and he provides that no one will be able to buy or to sell, except the one who has the mark, either the name of the beast or the number of his name.

18) Here is wisdom Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for the number is that of a man; and his number is six hundred and sixty-six.

It is really unknown how all these events will play out. That is why it's so important to keep each other informed. Thank for the links Benny.

[Salty Skipper]

Thanks Benny! I'll re-read.

[Salty Skipper]

Hi again, Benny! Thanks for the page number, but that's the 2004 fda study. Is that mentioned in the healthcare bill?

[Salty Skipper]

After reading this article, it appears as if this is a way to collect Patient Information, and not just keeping an account on prosthetic devices that have serial numbers.

Mr. Baldy, are you talking about the article or the bill? I'm just questioning the article because with all the 'legalese' in the bill, it can be easy to mistake one thing for another. I'm seriously open-minded to this being the mark of the beast, but I'm just not getting that from reading the bill. I have no doubt that the fda has studied such things.

[benny balerio]

After reading over the government bill, I'm almost 100% positive that this is talking about prosthetic devices that are used inside the body and requiring them to be "registered" with serial numbers and such. Most already are. I guess that they are trying to create a national registry for whatever reason of these devices.

Having said that, I'm not 100% sure, but almost. And, that's not to say that a required chip isn't coming in association with healthcare. I just don't think that this is "it."

After reading this article, it appears as if this is a way to collect Patient Information, and not just keeping an account on prosthetic devices that have serial numbers.

I find this very scary.

For those who have been Watching, I guess it's no secret that Obama has been associated with possibly being the "Beast from the Earth"; AKA - "The False Prophet". We definitely don't know this to be the case, however I find it very interesting, to say the least; that this Health Care Bill has passed, and within it's pages it is requiring that folks be implanted with an RFID chip.

It is unknown what the Mark of the Beast will be exactly; however in reading Revelation 13:11-18 - it is the False Prophet who is responsible for causing ALL to receive the Mark of the Beast.

Revelation 13:11-18 reads:

The Beast from the Earth

11) Then I saw another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb and he spoke as a dragon.

12) He exercises all the authority of the first beast in his presence And he makes the earth and those who dwell in it to worship the first beast, whose fatal wound was healed.

13) He performs great signs, so that he even makes fire come down out of heaven to the earth in the presence of men.

14) And he deceives those who dwell on the earth because of the signs which it was given him to perform in the presence of the beast, telling those who dwell on the earth to make an image to the beast who had the wound of the sword and has come to life.

15) And it was given to him to give breath to the image of the beast, so that the image of the beast would even speak and cause as many as do not worship the image of the beast to be killed.

16) And he causes all, the small and the great, and the rich and the poor, and the free men and the slaves, to be given a mark on their right hand or on their forehead,

17) and he provides that no one will be able to buy or to sell, except the one who has the mark, either the name of the beast or the number of his name.

18) Here is wisdom Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for the number is that of a man; and his number is six hundred and sixty-six.

It is really unknown how all these events will play out. That is why it's so important to keep each other informed. Thank for the links Benny.

Iv'e speculated that the false prophet would be muslim, arab,...and when he calls fire out of the sky or has seemed to,...that he would say that the anti-christ from the E.U. is there messiah, and that that would be how all riligions unite?

[Salty Skipper]

Here is a breakdown on the "types" of medical devices:
http://www.zoll.com/resources/medical-device-regulation/


◦Class I
Class I devices are subject to the least regulatory control. They present minimal potential for harm to the user and are often simpler in design than Class II or Class III devices. Bandage scissors are a Class I device.

◦Class II
Class II devices are those for which general controls alone are insufficient to assure safety and effectiveness, and existing methods are available to provide such assurances. Therefore additional (special) controls (tests and validation) are required to demonstrate safety and effectiveness. Patient Monitors fall under this category.

◦Class III
Class III is the most stringent regulatory category for devices. Class III devices are those for which insufficient information exists to assure safety and effectiveness solely through general and special controls.

[Mr Baldy]

Mr. Baldy, are you talking about the article or the bill?

Hi Salty,

I was talking about the articles, specifically the one which lead to the ways and means (Health-Care) link:

http://www.dailypaul.com/node/105079

The other article was written in 2004 - which should tell us that this whole Health care push, is no new idea. I just find it interesting that Obama will be the one who gets the credit for having the ability for getting it done - especially during the time period that we are now living in (considering the ENP(I) theory and all).

[benny balerio]

The following is what I found in the second link in the original post.
http://waysandmeans.house.gov/media/pdf ... 001xml.pdf
Page 1001
1 such sums as may be necessary for each of the fiscal years
2 2011 through 2014.’’.
3 (b) EFFECTIVE DATE.—The Secretary of Health and
4 Human Services shall begin awarding grants under section
5 399Z–1 of the Public Health Service Act, as added by sub6
section (b), not later than July 1, 2010, without regard
7 to whether or not final regulations have been issued under
8 section 399Z–1(h) of such Act
9 Subtitle C—National Medical
10 Device Registry
11 SEC. 2521. NATIONAL MEDICAL DEVICE REGISTRY.
12 (a) REGISTRY.—
13 (1) IN GENERAL.—Section 519 of the Federal
14 Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act (21 U.S.C. 360i) is
15 amended—
16 (A) by redesignating subsection (g) as sub17
section (h); and
18 (B) by inserting after subsection (f) the
19 following:
20 ‘‘National Medical Device Registry
21 ‘‘(g)(1) The Secretary shall establish a national med22
ical device registry (in this subsection referred to as the
23 ‘registry’) to facilitate analysis of postmarket safety and
24 outcomes data on each device that—
25 ‘‘(A) is or has been used in or on a patient; and
VerDate Nov 24 2008 12:51 Jul 14, 2009 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 01001 Fmt 6652 Sfmt 6201 C:\TEMP\AAHCA0~1.XML HOLCPC
July 14, 2009 (12:51 p.m.)
F:\P11\NHI\TRICOMM\AAHCA09_001.XML
f:\VHLC\071409\071409.140.xml (444390|2)
Page 1002
1 ‘‘(B) is—
2 ‘‘(i) a class III device; or
3 ‘‘(ii) a class II device that is implantable,
4 life-supporting, or life-sustaining.
5 ‘‘(2) In developing the registry, the Secretary shall,
6 in consultation with the Commissioner of Food and Drugs,
7 the Administrator of the Centers for Medicare & Medicaid
8 Services, the head of the Office of the National Coordi9
nator for Health Information Technology, and the Sec10
retary of Veterans Affairs, determine the best methods
11 for—
12 ‘‘(A) including in the registry, in a manner con13
sistent with subsection (f), appropriate information
14 to identify each device described in paragraph (1) by
15 type, model, and serial number or other unique iden16
tifier;
17 ‘‘(B) validating methods for analyzing patient
18 safety and outcomes data from multiple sources and
19 for linking such data with the information included
20 in the registry as described in subparagraph (A), in21
cluding, to the extent feasible, use of—
22 ‘‘(i) data provided to the Secretary under
23 other provisions of this chapter; and
24 ‘‘(ii) information from public and private
25 sources identified under paragraph (3);
VerDate Nov

To be implemented in 36 months:
1004
1 gram under title XVIII of the Social Secu2
rity Act or from the health systems of the
3 Department of Veterans Affairs);
4 ‘‘(II) private sector health-related
5 electronic data (such as pharmaceutical
6 purchase data and health insurance claims
7 data); and
8 ‘‘(III) other data as the Secretary
9 deems necessary to permit postmarket as10
sessment of device safety and effectiveness;
11 and
12 ‘‘(ii) link data obtained under clause (i)
13 with information in the registry.
14 ‘‘(B) In this paragraph, the term ‘data’ refers to in15
formation respecting a device described in paragraph (1),
16 including claims data, patient survey data, standardized
17 analytic files that allow for the pooling and analysis of
18 data from disparate data environments, electronic health
19 records, and any other data deemed appropriate by the
20 Secretary.
21 ‘‘(4) Not later than 36 months after the date of the
22 enactment of this subsection, the Secretary shall promul23
gate regulations for establishment and operation of the
24 registry under paragraph (1). Such regulations—
VerDate Nov

[denise]

[Salty Skipper]

The part to be implemented in 36 months is the standardized system of collecting and storing patient data. It's what the hospital director on the radio talk show was speaking of on the program I mentioned earlier in the thread. He specifically said there are no plans for any sort of 'chip' for patient id. Patients will still present the same forms of ID they do now. Drivers license/insurance card...that sort of thing.

[foytik]

I agree with Salty. After a quick read it looks like those that have implanted devices (RFID?) will be required to be in a registry, but I dont see any place where it says that everyone will be required to obtain such a device. I've noticed that frequently the title of internet stories does not quite match up with the actual story.

[mguard]

" they won't kill us, we are the workers, they need us".....Schindlers list


Reading through this thread I was struck by some of the comments as being a bit too trusting in the government for comfort.

Someone said" If we don't denounce Jesus we'll be fine" ( paraphrase) wow, wouldn't base my life on that interpretation of scripture.

It strikes me that they have gone through a whole lot of effort with these medical device rules, for us to say "Oh it means data storage" Er yeah but with this new rule, it is easily adaptable to a chip, isn't it ? Just like the homeland security bills can be used anyway they choose. These are vaguely written on purpose to include things later.

The guy on the radio show, reminds me of the Germans who told the gas chamber candidates they were getting a shower.

Go back to sleep people, the government will take good care of you.

I really hope that the authoritarian mindset doesn't get the best of anyone. Remember we are to Obey the Lord and the time comes when we will have to choose whom we shall obey. God or Mammon

[david]

OBAMACARE: RFID CHIP IMPLANT IN 36 MONTHS:
MANDATORY 666-VERICHIP MEDICAL IMPLANT UNDER OBAMA HEALTHCARE

BOTH HOUSE AND SENATE HEALTH BILLS REQUIRE THE MICRO CHIPPING OF AMERICANS – 3/18/10

What exactly is a class II device that is implantable? Approved by the FDA, a class II implantable device is an “implantable radio frequency transponder system for patient identification and health information.” The purpose of a class II device is to collect data in medical patients such as “claims data, patient survey data, standardized analytic files that allow for the pooling and analysis of data from disparate data environments, electronic health records, and any other data deemed appropriate by the Secretary.”

The purpose of a class II device is to collect data in medical patients such as “claims data, patient survey data, standardized analytic files that allow for the pooling and analysis of data from disparate data environments, electronic health records, and any other data deemed appropriate by the Secretary

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


RFID IMPLANT TRACKING NOT MENTIONED in BILL

I have worked in materials & electronics R&D for over 25 years. Making the claim HR 3200 specifically references RFID implantable chips just because it mentions Class II devices is a far stretch. Veri-Chip is a class II device; but that does not prove its reference here. That would be like saying all UL (Under Writer Laboratories) approved electrical devices are wall outlets because they are “embedded” in a wall. As anyone can see there tens even hundreds of “UL” listed devices in our homes.

There are thousands upon thousands of FDA class II devices listed. Most Class II devices are not even electronic. I’m certain you have used a class II device if not even use one now. Does that mean we all have the mark? Some Class II consist of organic and inorganic compounds. Do you have a filling in your tooth? I bet Pamela Anderson has at least well, two and may be considered life sustainable if she were out at sea.

Seriously, HR3200 as documented :

“class II device that is implantable, life-supporting”

. It’s clearly for devices like heart monitors, pace makers and breathing apparatuses.

I read through and examined this particular section of the bill after it passed the Senate. The main concern I have is under section B, “electronic health records” and who would have access and control over them. My own health records have been in an electric data base at my local clinic for a while now. My concern would be if the government has access to it. Otherwise I see no reason to believe HR3200 specifically refers to an implantable RFID chip for tracking purposes. There is just no reference to it.

I believe their intention is to monitor major medical devices, complaints and performance in the field. Just as it says. The FDA is already doing most of this and in fact this may trickle down to the FDA.

To illustrate how wide spread the applications are for a class II medical device check out:

FDA Device Class Web Site:

http://www.fda.gov/MedicalDevices/Devic ... efault.htm
The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has established classifications for approximately 1,700 different generic types of devices and grouped them into 16 medical specialties referred to as panels. Each of these generic types of devices is assigned to one of three regulatory classes based on the level of control necessary to assure the safety and effectiveness of the device. The three classes and the requirements which apply to them are:


david

[Jericho]

Maybe during the great tribulation people will be lining up to be implanted out of fear and desperation, but people are not at that point yet and America is still heavily armed. Unless something major changes between now and 36 months I don't see it happening.

[benny balerio]

OBAMACARE: RFID CHIP IMPLANT IN 36 MONTHS:
MANDATORY 666-VERICHIP MEDICAL IMPLANT UNDER OBAMA HEALTHCARE

BOTH HOUSE AND SENATE HEALTH BILLS REQUIRE THE MICRO CHIPPING OF AMERICANS – 3/18/10

What exactly is a class II device that is implantable? Approved by the FDA, a class II implantable device is an “implantable radio frequency transponder system for patient identification and health information.” The purpose of a class II device is to collect data in medical patients such as “claims data, patient survey data, standardized analytic files that allow for the pooling and analysis of data from disparate data environments, electronic health records, and any other data deemed appropriate by the Secretary.”

The purpose of a class II device is to collect data in medical patients such as “claims data, patient survey data, standardized analytic files that allow for the pooling and analysis of data from disparate data environments, electronic health records, and any other data deemed appropriate by the Secretary

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


RFID IMPLANT TRACKING NOT MENTIONED in BILL

I have worked in materials & electronics R&D for over 25 years. Making the claim HR 3200 specifically references RFID implantable chips just because it mentions Class II devices is a far stretch. Veri-Chip is a class II device; but that does not prove its reference here. That would be like saying all UL (Under Writer Laboratories) approved electrical devices are wall outlets because they are “embedded” in a wall. As anyone can see there tens even hundreds of “UL” listed devices in our homes.

There are thousands upon thousands of FDA class II devices listed. Most Class II devices are not even electronic. I’m certain you have used a class II device if not even use one now. Does that mean we all have the mark? Some Class II consist of organic and inorganic compounds. Do you have a filling in your tooth? I bet Pamela Anderson has at least well, two and may be considered life sustainable if she were out at sea.

Seriously, HR3200 as documented :

“class II device that is implantable, life-supporting”

. It’s clearly for devices like heart monitors, pace makers and breathing apparatuses.

I read through and examined this particular section of the bill after it passed the Senate. The main concern I have is under section B, “electronic health records” and who would have access and control over them. My own health records have been in an electric data base at my local clinic for a while now. My concern would be if the government has access to it. Otherwise I see no reason to believe HR3200 specifically refers to an implantable RFID chip for tracking purposes. There is just no reference to it.

I believe their intention is to monitor major medical devices, complaints and performance in the field. Just as it says. The FDA is already doing most of this and in fact this may trickle down to the FDA.

To illustrate how wide spread the applications are for a class II medical device check out:

FDA Device Class Web Site:

http://www.fda.gov/MedicalDevices/Devic ... efault.htm
The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has established classifications for approximately 1,700 different generic types of devices and grouped them into 16 medical specialties referred to as panels. Each of these generic types of devices is assigned to one of three regulatory classes based on the level of control necessary to assure the safety and effectiveness of the device. The three classes and the requirements which apply to them are:


david

I still have to disagree,unless you can explin away the following:
I am going to have to disagree with your assessment.
The following suggests that they want to ensure that the chip does not migrate to other parts of the body once it has been injected into the human body.
You will find the following on page 5
D. Migration Testing of Implanted Transponder
We recommend that you conduct testing of the implanted transponder to demonstrate that the
transponder will not migrate after implantation.
Page 4....it even uses the word "BIOCOMPATABILITY"
http://www.fda.gov/downloads/MedicalDev ... 072191.pdf
http://www.fda.gov/downloads/MedicalDev ... 072191.pdf

[david]

Benny, that makes complete sense. Is that in the signed bill?

respectfully

david

[benny balerio]

Benny, that makes complete sense. Is that in the signed bill?

respectfully

david

Yes David,...I came across this a few minutes ago..you may know how to do a back run like this guy;

Submitted by E. Oregon 4 Ron on Sat, 12/12/2009 - 15:40.
"Page Not Found---may have been moved"-----until I removed some excess dots and tried the link again. Here it is, unless they moved the page again!
http://www.fda.gov/MedicalDevices/ucm072141.htm
Here are some comments from a person checking into this:
"in the first 1000+ pages of health reform, there was a section between pages 1001 and 1005 dealing with implantable medical devices. On the surface it seemed to be only about heart implants and monitors, and some other implantable parts like my fake knee……but when I saw all the changes to statutes and code, definitions and such……I started running it down. After back tracking all the changes….I began seeing lists of “stakeholders” who had “vested” interests in these “devices……..Angel-mark, Monsanto, Choicepoint, Accenture and Verichip…"---


About the word Biocompatibilty...it's on page 4.......
http://www.fda.gov/downloads/MedicalDev ... 072191.pdf
http://www.fda.gov/downloads/MedicalDev ... 072191.pdf

[joyfulchild]

WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW IS WHY

WHEN FACED WITH THE POTENTIAL AND FRIGHTENING FULFILLMENT OF BIBLE PROPHECY ARE THERE THOSE OF US WHO PLAY THE "SCULLY" (SKEPTICAL)TO THE REST OF THE (TRUST NO ONE) MULDERS?

WHAT DOES IT TAKE TO GET ON BOARD AND SERIOUSLY STUDY THE WORD? THIS IS THE ONLY WAY WE WILL KNOW...AND ALL THE ASSESSMENT OF THE DATES OF THINGS SUCH AS ABOVE CERTAIN POSTINGS IS NOT GOING TO CONVINCE ME.

WE SEEM TO BE MORE AND MORE INTO DARK TIMES AHEAD AD THE ONLY WAY WE WILL STAY FEARLESS AND STRONG IS WITH THE LORD.

THE ABOVE PLAN BY THE HEALTH CARE REFORM IS INDEED A POINT TO REALLY DIG PRAYERFULLY DEEP AND ASK THE LORD TO REVEAL IT TO YOU...

PERHAPS THIS IS THE WAY WE WILL KNOW FOR SURE AND THE ONLY WAY.

IM NOT SAYING THIS IS SO -JUST MY THOUGHTS

MEL

[GodsStudent]

If its possible, I agree with most of the comments on this thread and think "splitting the difference" entails mainly waiting for more details to emerge. The legalist language should be of great concern as this is what many lawyers hang their shingles on. I know, I own a business that is in the legal field, and I work for many different attorneys. Many of my days are spent talking with attorneys in a manner that compares to "posturing." Posturing, (my word, not theirs) is the manner by which someone forms an argument to defend the position from which they are coming. So, IMO, we are far from free and clear of this chip....I would actually argue to the contrary based on the fact that what I have read leaves me feeling as though the content of the material is literally "open end."

That said, I do not feel that these chips, in the context by which they are being presently introduced are "it." So, I also agree with Salty Skipper. The MOB is about loyalty and until its identified by the one whom it is that seeks such loyalty, it may be fair and right for a person to say that they were obeying the laws of the land in taking such a chip.

The scriptures associate the MOB with the ability to buy and sell. Everything I know thusfar leads me to believe that some very hungry people are going to struggle with the decision to not take the chip and alternately starve to death. Even in the short term, one has to have a great willingness to be in that position to refrain from taking the mark and endure hunger or even starvation. I believe the motivators associated with being able to work within the confines of society will be sufficient in and of themselves....I don't anticipate being "tricked" with regards to the chip.

So, I don't exactly disagree with the early on post about taking these medical chips

Even though it is in 36 months,....and if many take the chip under their skin,...it is not a sin unless one is required to denounce Jesus as Lord.
I would laugh at them if it got to that point

However, I prefer not to have any foriegn objects implanted in me. The words TRACKING DEVICES come to mind and at least I can turn my cell phone off or leave it at home if I want to....So, the control elements to this are far more than I can tolerate. Then....there is the thread about the dogs and cats getting cancer from their chips.....honestly, in light of this study, what are our healthcare providers thinking of....talk about an oxy moron.......


Where is my tin foil hat? !!!

[benny balerio]

If its possible, I agree with most of the comments on this thread and think "splitting the difference" entails mainly waiting for more details to emerge. The legalist language should be of great concern as this is what many lawyers hang their shingles on. I know, I own a business that is in the legal field, and I work for many different attorneys. Many of my days are spent talking with attorneys in a manner that compares to "posturing." Posturing, (my word, not theirs) is the manner by which someone forms an argument to defend the position from which they are coming. So, IMO, we are far from free and clear of this chip....I would actually argue to the contrary based on the fact that what I have read leaves me feeling as though the content of the material is literally "open end."

That said, I do not feel that these chips, in the context by which they are being presently introduced are "it." So, I also agree with Salty Skipper. The MOB is about loyalty and until its identified by the one whom it is that seeks such loyalty, it may be fair and right for a person to say that they were obeying the laws of the land in taking such a chip.

The scriptures associate the MOB with the ability to buy and sell. Everything I know thusfar leads me to believe that some very hungry people are going to struggle with the decision to not take the chip and alternately starve to death. Even in the short term, one has to have a great willingness to be in that position to refrain from taking the mark and endure hunger or even starvation. I believe the motivators associated with being able to work within the confines of society will be sufficient in and of themselves....I don't anticipate being "tricked" with regards to the chip.

So, I don't exactly disagree with the early on post about taking these medical chips

Even though it is in 36 months,....and if many take the chip under their skin,...it is not a sin unless one is required to denounce Jesus as Lord.
I would laugh at them if it got to that point

However, I prefer not to have any foriegn objects implanted in me. The words TRACKING DEVICES come to mind and at least I can turn my cell phone off or leave it at home if I want to....So, the control elements to this are far more than I can tolerate. Then....there is the thread about the dogs and cats getting cancer from their chips.....honestly, in light of this study, what are our healthcare providers thinking of....talk about an oxy moron.......


Where is my tin foil hat? !!!

My understanding of prophecy is that it would not become mandatory to receive the mark until the A.O.D. begins,and that is when mankind will be required to worship this beast and take his mark.
Now to give a little more insight.
In the first half of Daniels 70th week the Jews will sacrifice at the temple "UNOBSTRUCTED"
The two witnesses and 144,000 jews will witness to the lost "UNOBSTUCTED"
A great multitude that no man could number will receive the Lord and too will witness to many more "UNOBSTRUCTED"
The two witnesses,...the 144,000,..and the great multitude are "all SAINTS."
It is only when the A. O. D. begins That :


7And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

Now I have a surprise for you guys:
The system will be near set up and then the Bride will be caught up to meet the Lord in the air.
Gotta remember,..this mark of the beast will be global and it is going to take one heck of a global shock before mankind will pull together for it's very survival!!!

In combination of Ezekial 38;18-20 and the pre-trib rapture, it will accomplish just exactly that.
Read my topic in the debate section called The Pre-Tribulation Rapture Timing.

And if you do not believe,...You will soon believe if you are truely being guided by the Holy Spirit of Truth.

4But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.

[david]

If its possible, I agree with most of the comments on this thread and think "splitting the difference" entails mainly waiting for more details to emerge. The legalist language should be of great concern as this is what many lawyers hang their shingles on.........

I totally agree with you on your post. There is wiggle room in the language. Although RFID is not specifically in there, they can say well "Class II" daddada.... then subsequently another bill added, or used in combo with the patriot bill.

Just thinking here: Does the AC or FP need the Health a Care Bill or another bill to institute control or issue a mark? I don't think so. Power is granted by ten Kings (three being subdue). He is the "lawless" one, people will be persecuted tested and put do death. He rules globally, so does matter whats in any of our laws because when he comes to power there will be a new global law and order.


david

[revelation2012]

Can an RFID chip or device have information added to it or updated? What is to say that the first step is not to do a benign step in simply tracking medical devices and or medical records? Can this later at some point be used to keep track of personal information like your birth certificate and social security card number (which ironically is issued by the UN)? I don’t know how many of you Americans are aware of it but did you know your birth certificate under UCC LAW is issued by a Bank Certificate Company. Your birth certificate is traded under the stock exchange and your account is held as a collateral bond by the US Treasury. I am still learning about this but it indeed can be owned and traded by a company. Look at it. It is in CAPITAL LETTERS which is a legal entity and is owned and issued by Central Banks. Do some research you will see I am correct. You have never been free or known real freedom.

What if this device can also be used to track your every whereabouts later? I bet it can from Jump Street. This could be updated to take information to keep track of your debits and credits. Think about it. Once we go down this path your are more of a slave than you already are. It is time to free yourself and your mind. God first and all will follow. I for one will not submit to this tyranny or become a participant to it. I don't care at all what anyone says I will not become part of this system. If this comes about you will see this country fall apart.

I have seen conversations and interviews with people who say this chip or tracking trip has been a wet dream of the illuminati for a LONG TIME.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 215075609#

[david]

WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW IS WHY

WHEN FACED WITH THE POTENTIAL AND FRIGHTENING FULFILLMENT OF BIBLE PROPHECY ARE THERE THOSE OF US WHO PLAY THE "SCULLY" (SKEPTICAL)TO THE REST OF THE (TRUST NO ONE) MULDERS?.....
MEL

Hi Mel how are you?

I agree with what your saying, it helps bring attention where my main focus should be; to rely on the Holy Spirit to the point where all peace passes understanding. I hope you don't form your opinion of me from one post. When I post something it may not reflect where my faith, hope or prayer life is. I see this part as a side hobby that concerns facets of my belief. FP is not my primary source for Spiritual fulfillment; prayer, the Word, my marriage and church are. Sometimes I like a good debate which is not always edifying but sometimes it can be. There are other boards for Spiritual reflection, which I should spend more time in. Since this is the "MOB" forum, well the discussion is going to be around what people consider to be the mark. Because I engage in debate does not mean I don't put my faith in the Spirit first. At the same time I am glad you are bringing this to light. I can always use help being pointed in right direction, to the Spirit.

Signed

Scully

BTW: I like the X-Files

[learningeachday]

Can an RFID chip or device have information added to it or updated? What is to say that the first step is not to do a benign step in simply tracking medical devices and or medical records? Can this later at some point be used to keep track of personal information like your birth certificate and social security card number (which ironically is issued by the UN)?

My answer would be yes, seeing as VeriChip acquired Steel Vault (now re-named PositiveID) last fall. As I understand it, Steel Vault/PositiveID is a identity theft protection company. So we can have ID theft protection (therefore they have access to financial information) and health records all right there handy in one little amazing chip! It's not hard at all to see it taking the place of a credit card, either.

http://www.news-medical.net/news/200911 ... ition.aspx

I don't see it being THE mark of the beast. I see it as something they will get people used to, make them think they HAVE to have it--CAN'T live without it (like our cell phones!)--and then associate it with the mark. Like, "Oh, you won't take the mark, huh? Then we will turn off your chip...no more health care, no more ability to buy or sell..." Just my thoughts...

[revelation2012]

Like, "Oh, you won't take the mark, huh? Then we will turn off your chip...no more health care, no more ability to buy or sell..." Just my thoughts...

I see this exactly it is going to be an all encompassing control measure.

[SueAnn]

Are you all aware that the Baby boomers (those born 1945-?) are coming "of age"? They asre starting to hit retirement age...Social Security...Medicare...etc. Fascinating that the largest group of Americans ever to reach retirement age at the same time that HealthCare and Social Security are having major law changes.

Get the chip implanted or you lose all health benefits from the government. Period. We won't kill you, but how long can you live without that medication that you must take every day?

[extravagantchristian]

Sueann

[SueAnn]

And another thing I find striking...WHY put anything at all about medical device transponders in the health care bill? WHY? There MUST be a serious connection, otherwise it feels like a non-sequitor. WHY is it in that bill?

[revelation2012]

So you advocate getting the chip to stay in the system? Each will have to make their own choice.

If you didn't think that this was something you have already been living in what I would term as endentured servatude. Take a look at this article and the research for your self. You are owned by the Federal Reserve and have been since the 1930s:

http://usahitman.com/?p=1277

I know I never concented to anything like this.

[Jericho]

Dr. Thomas Ice made an interesting point about the Mark of the Beast I never considered before. He said the judgments in the tribulation are meant to polarize the world into believers and un-believers. It's a unique time in history, became never before could you know if someone would get saved or not, they might get saved on there death-bed for all you know. However during the tribulation you will know, based on the Mark of the Beast, who is a believer or unbeliever. There's no middle ground, and when Jesus return's those unbelievers will be removed from the Earth.

As for me, I'll draw the line at implanting anything on or under my skin, rather it's the Mark or not. There's too many issues with freedom and privacy not to.

[SueAnn]

So you advocate getting the chip to stay in the system?

Please read my comments one more time. I cannot find one syllable in them that states that I advocate taking the chip. Sheesh.

[revelation2012]

So you advocate getting the chip to stay in the system?

Please read my comments one more time. I cannot find one syllable in them that states that I advocate taking the chip. Sheesh.

Gotcha - hard to pick up sarcasm in text.

[GodsStudent]

As for me, I'll draw the line at implanting anything on or under my skin, rather it's the Mark or not. There's too many issues with freedom and privacy not to.

I know I said it before, too.....one thing leads to another and whether or not this chip, as it stands right now, can be clearly labeled the coming MOB, it is an intrusion so great that I cannot allow it for myself or my family. If healthcare requires it, I will need to see the Great Healer for all of my medical needs.

[Adamantine]

All told it is about a form of control that even God does not wish it seems to have for His children.
I expect there is still a fair amount of freedom in the Millennium to speak against God and His son's kingdom.
I also know the scripture about ruling with a rod of Iron.
In any case God is very much for independence of the human spirit.
My two cents.

[revelation2012]

All told it is about a form of control that even God does not wish it seems to have for His children.
I expect there is still a fair amount of freedom in the Millennium to speak against God and His son's kingdom.
I also know the scripture about ruling with a rod of Iron.
In any case God is very much for independence of the human spirit.
My two cents.

What happened to David when he wanted to number his people?

Also if none of you have read the article I posted above, I HIGHLY SUGGEST YOU DO. You already are numbered and sold. Here is the article again:

http://usahitman.com/?p=1277

[denise]

Its all about conditioning. Look, when FDR introduced the Social Security Act, some people FREAKED OUT, with good reason and over time we became accusomed to having a number. We were "promised" that it wasn't a form of ID, but over time that's what it's evolved into. This is just the next step. And again there will be those who protest, with good reason, and again over time peoople will become accustomed to it...until eventually...we will be given a REAL choice. Anyone who thinks we're going to have a big 666 stamped on our forheads is mistaken, the devil is WAAAAY to slick for that. People are going to BEG for the mark, it will be a MUST HAVE item. Trust me, I work for a major cellurlar phone company, I'm in customer service, and people have already become "zombies" to the MUST HAVE mindset of this technology...it's really sad. To incorporate all the different components of our livelihoods into one simple, conveneient system is just the logical conclusion...