Rewards in heaven...

Discussion and debate not related to prophecy.

Rewards in heaven...

Postby CorporalJohnny on Sat Jan 17, 2015 4:51 pm

I hear a lot of preachers that talk about rewards in heaven, and I feel like a lot of Christians are motivated out of a desire for rewards. I have read a lot of theories about the Bema seat, and all that, but I tend to think that we are a bit misguided on this. For me personally, I don't want any rewards. I know the man I am, what I've done and what I'm capable of, and without Christ I'm nothing. If just getting to heaven and seeing Christ and being free from Sin is a reward, it's the only one I want. Am I wrong to think this way?

I read the Parabale of the Workers in the Vinyard and I can not reconcile this system of rewards where some believers are rewarded and others are not. Perry Stone teaches a lot about rewards, and while I enjoy most of his insights on Prophecy, I do not share his views on rewards.

For the kingdom of heaven is like unto a man that is an householder, which went out early in the morning to hire labourers into his vineyard. And when he had agreed with the labourers for a penny a day, he sent them into his vineyard. And he went out about the third hour, and saw others standing idle in the marketplace, And said unto them; Go ye also into the vineyard, and whatsoever is right I will give you. And they went their way. Again he went out about the sixth and ninth hour, and did likewise. And about the eleventh hour he went out, and found others standing idle, and saith unto them, Why stand ye here all the day idle? They say unto him, Because no man hath hired us. He saith unto them, Go ye also into the vineyard; and whatsoever is right, that shall ye receive. So when even was come, the lord of the vineyard saith unto his steward, Call the labourers, and give them their hire, beginning from the last unto the first. And when they came that were hired about the eleventh hour, they received every man a penny. But when the first came, they supposed that they should have received more; and they likewise received every man a penny. And when they had received it, they murmured against the goodman of the house, Saying, These last have wrought but one hour, and thou hast made them equal unto us, which have borne the burden and heat of the day. But he answered one of them, and said, Friend, I do thee no wrong: didst not thou agree with me for a penny? Take that thine is, and go thy way: I will give unto this last, even as unto thee. Is it not lawful for me to do what I will with mine own? Is thine eye evil, because I am good? So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen.
— Matthew 20:1–16, King James Version
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Abiding in His Word on Sat Jan 17, 2015 7:06 pm

CorporalJohnny, we had a rather lengthy discussion about this topic recently. You can check it out here.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Jericho on Sat Jan 17, 2015 8:05 pm

Is it fair to say eternal life is a reward in itself?
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby CorporalJohnny on Sat Jan 17, 2015 11:00 pm

I see that thread but no one addressed the parable of the workers in the field all being treated equally for their work, despite some feeling as though they worked harder or longer. This rewards stuff makes me sad. Christ did it all, why do we even think we are worthy of any reward? I don't want a reward because I can never truly earn it. Christ earned it, not me.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby shorttribber on Sat Jan 17, 2015 11:21 pm

CorporalJohnny wrote:I see that thread but no one addressed the parable of the workers in the field all being treated equally for their work, despite some feeling as though they worked harder or longer. This rewards stuff makes me sad. Christ did it all, why do we even think we are worthy of any reward? I don't want a reward because I can never truly earn it. Christ earned it, not me.


:a3:

CorporalJohnny wrote:. If just getting to heaven and seeing Christ and being free from Sin is a reward, it's the only one I want.


:a3:

CorporalJohnny wrote:Am I wrong to think this way?


I don't think so....I feel the exact same way.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Sonbeam on Sun Jan 18, 2015 9:25 am

Ditto! CJ and ST,

Take a look at this most quoted passage on rewards:

1 Cor 3:10 By the grace God has given me, I laid a foundation as a wise builder, and someone else is building on it. But each one should build with care. 11 For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, 13 their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work. 14 If what has been built survives, the builder will receive a reward. 15 If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames.


Then go back and read 1 Cor Chap 3 without the above passage ...... and see that Paul's thoughts/comments on God's building are seamlessly completed. Could this passage have been added by someone other than Paul later on? This passage does not harmonize or is compatible with everything else in the epistles written by Paul IMO.

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Last edited by Sonbeam on Sun Jan 18, 2015 12:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Mark F on Sun Jan 18, 2015 10:58 am

Sonbeam wrote:Ditto! CJ and ST,

Take a look at this most quoted passage on rewards:

1 Cor 3:10 By the grace God has given me, I laid a foundation as a wise builder, and someone else is building on it. But each one should build with care. 11 For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, 13 their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work. 14 If what has been built survives, the builder will receive a reward. 15 If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames.


Then go back and read 1 Cor Chap 3 without it...... and see that Paul's thought /comment on God's building is seamlessly completed Could this passage have been added by someone other than Paul later on? This passage does not harmonize or is compatible with everything else in the epistles written by Paul IMO.

sonbeam


Are you thinking that passage is on rewards or that it is just the most quoted passage on rewards?
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Sonbeam on Sun Jan 18, 2015 12:24 pm

I think it is the most often quoted passage on rewards. At least this has been my experience.

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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Mark F on Sun Jan 18, 2015 12:42 pm

With that I agree, I don't agree that it is speaking of rewards for all Christians but that Paul is instructing teachers. I think there is an old thread here on that.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Keeping Alert on Mon Jan 19, 2015 7:51 am

Sonbeam wrote:Ditto! CJ and ST,

Take a look at this most quoted passage on rewards:

1 Cor 3:10 By the grace God has given me, I laid a foundation as a wise builder, and someone else is building on it. But each one should build with care. 11 For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, 13 their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work. 14 If what has been built survives, the builder will receive a reward. 15 If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames.


Then go back and read 1 Cor Chap 3 without the above passage ...... and see that Paul's thoughts/comments on God's building are seamlessly completed. Could this passage have been added by someone other than Paul later on? This passage does not harmonize or is compatible with everything else in the epistles written by Paul IMO.

sonbeam


Sonbeam, I would caution against thinking anything has been added or taken away from our canonized bible that we have in our hands. If we subscribe to the possibility that the bible has not been miraculously preserved by God then how do we answer our critics that the bible is inerrant?

I believe the God who created the whole universe is more than capable of keeping His Word true. There may be reasons to suspect this and that, but these are after all man's own suppositions and presumptions... Do we dare to give weight to man's breath than God's Word?

If we don't understand a passage, let it pass... Ask God to reveal the truth to you... Read more... Many have read upon these passages and do not find anything incongruous.

Love-in-Christ,
KA
Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour.

πατερ δοξασον σου το ονομα
Father, glorify thy name.

Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby shorttribber on Mon Jan 19, 2015 10:44 am

Keeping Alert wrote:Sonbeam, I would caution against thinking anything has been added or taken away from our canonized bible that we have in our hands. If we subscribe to the possibility that the bible has not been miraculously preserved by God then how do we answer our critics that the bible is inerrant? I believe the God who created the whole universe is more than capable of keeping His Word true. There may be reasons to suspect this and that, but these are after all man's own suppositions and presumptions... Do we dare to give weight to man's breath than God's Word?If we don't understand a passage, let it pass... Ask God to reveal the truth to you... Read more... Many have read upon these passages and do not find anything incongruous.


Very well said...and I agree.

Sonbeam wrote:Ditto! CJ and ST,

Take a look at this most quoted passage on rewards:

1 Cor 3:10 By the grace God has given me, I laid a foundation as a wise builder, and someone else is building on it. But each one should build with care. 11 For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, 13 their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work. 14 If what has been built survives, the builder will receive a reward. 15 If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames.


Then go back and read 1 Cor Chap 3 without the above passage ...... and see that Paul's thoughts/comments on God's building are seamlessly completed. Could this passage have been added by someone other than Paul later on? This passage does not harmonize or is compatible with everything else in the epistles written by Paul IMO.

sonbeam


I did as you suggested and found that they all harmonize if understood properly. How these passages have been quoted are incorrect I think, and that may be why they seem improper to you.

Let me post the verses once more......

10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

What particular portion of these verses do you find non-harmonious?
Is it verses 14 and 15 in particular, or the entire idea of Us or Anyone WORKING, and That Work Effecting the Reward?
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Sonbeam on Mon Jan 19, 2015 5:34 pm

shorttribber wrote:
Let me post the verses once more......

10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

What particular portion of these verses do you find non-harmonious?
Is it verses 14 and 15 in particular, or the entire idea of Us or Anyone WORKING, and That Work Effecting the Reward?


I find the whole idea of the children of God working for rewards to weaken and confuse the Gospel of grace. The doctrine that this passage is setting forth, whether that was the intent or not, is that not only faith but also our works play a big part (though not a damning one according to verse 15) in the process of salvation.

If in fact all of a Christian’s works are going to go under scrutiny at the end of the age, then I would venture to say that undoubtedly every Christian will have some works that will not make the grade.

Therefore, all Christians will then be saved as by fire, i. e, go through some form of purification, refining or purging of imperfections. Perhaps landing in purgatory, as the Catholic church teaches, might then be a possibility. :scared :cheeky:

Being saved so as by fire has been likened by some as being saved by “the skin of our teeth”—hardly a thought that would help a child of God enter into the rest of Christ.”

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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Sonbeam on Mon Jan 19, 2015 5:39 pm

Keeping Alert wrote:
Sonbeam wrote:Ditto! CJ and ST,

Take a look at this most quoted passage on rewards:

1 Cor 3:10 By the grace God has given me, I laid a foundation as a wise builder, and someone else is building on it. But each one should build with care. 11 For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, 13 their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work. 14 If what has been built survives, the builder will receive a reward. 15 If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames.


Then go back and read 1 Cor Chap 3 without the above passage ...... and see that Paul's thoughts/comments on God's building are seamlessly completed. Could this passage have been added by someone other than Paul later on? This passage does not harmonize or is compatible with everything else in the epistles written by Paul IMO.

sonbeam


Sonbeam, I would caution against thinking anything has been added or taken away from our canonized bible that we have in our hands. If we subscribe to the possibility that the bible has not been miraculously preserved by God then how do we answer our critics that the bible is inerrant?
Love-in-Christ,
KA


KA,

I believe that the scriptures that we have on hand are exactly what God has intended for us to have -- including the passage we are discussing. But I would like to stick with the rewards topic at the moment and not get sidetracked by the inerrancy issue.

Blessings,
sonbeam
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby shorttribber on Mon Jan 19, 2015 6:19 pm

Sonbeam wrote:
shorttribber wrote:
Let me post the verses once more......

10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

What particular portion of these verses do you find non-harmonious?
Is it verses 14 and 15 in particular, or the entire idea of Us or Anyone WORKING, and That Work Effecting the Reward?


I find the whole idea of the children of God working for rewards to weaken and confuse the Gospel of grace. The doctrine that this passage is setting forth, whether that was the intent or not, is that not only faith but also our works play a big part (though not a damning one according to verse 15) in the process of salvation.

If in fact all of a Christian’s works are going to go under scrutiny at the end of the age, then I would venture to say that undoubtedly every Christian will have some works that will not make the grade.

Therefore, all Christians will then be saved as by fire, i. e, go through some form of purification, refining or purging of imperfections. Perhaps landing in purgatory, as the Catholic church teaches, might then be a possibility. :scared :cheeky:

Being saved so as by fire has been likened by some as being saved by “the skin of our teeth”—hardly a thought that would help a child of God enter into the rest of Christ.”

sonbeam


:grin: answer soon coming....I think you'll agree and be very satisfied to here it....got to go box up some stuff for a few hours...I'm sorry for the delay....hopefully back soon
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Keeping Alert on Mon Jan 19, 2015 6:39 pm

Sonbeam wrote:I find the whole idea of the children of God working for rewards to weaken and confuse the Gospel of grace.


Sonbeam, I totally agree with you.

The passage that you gave as proof text to me is sufficient that we cannot serve for rewards.

Our eyes are to be fixed on Jesus...

Nevertheless, it is one thing to serve for rewards and another to know that there are rewards awaiting us...

I would be very worried for those "Christians" that serve for the purpose of receiving rewards.

Personally, I do not limit God's Grace... He is the owner of the everything... would it be out of sync with his character to give His Children a few more gifts? :wink:
Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour.

πατερ δοξασον σου το ονομα
Father, glorify thy name.

Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby shorttribber on Mon Jan 19, 2015 10:48 pm

sorry, got in too late....need to post tomorrow...night night
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby shorttribber on Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:01 am

Sonbeam wrote:
shorttribber wrote:
Let me post the verses once more......

10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

What particular portion of these verses do you find non-harmonious?
Is it verses 14 and 15 in particular, or the entire idea of Us or Anyone WORKING, and That Work Effecting the Reward?


I find the whole idea of the children of God working for rewards to weaken and confuse the Gospel of grace. The doctrine that this passage is setting forth, whether that was the intent or not, is that not only faith but also our works play a big part (though not a damning one according to verse 15) in the process of salvation.

If in fact all of a Christian’s works are going to go under scrutiny at the end of the age, then I would venture to say that undoubtedly every Christian will have some works that will not make the grade.

Therefore, all Christians will then be saved as by fire, i. e, go through some form of purification, refining or purging of imperfections. Perhaps landing in purgatory, as the Catholic church teaches, might then be a possibility. :scared :cheeky:

Being saved so as by fire has been likened by some as being saved by “the skin of our teeth”—hardly a thought that would help a child of God enter into the rest of Christ.”

sonbeam


That's what I thought, and the way these portions of scripture have generally been understood have surely helped to add to the misconception of them.

Ok, let me first begin with Paul's words, "I have laid the foundation".
The preceding words to "I have laid the foundation". Firstly, he Alone Did Not do so, for he says in another place.....Eph 2:19 Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
20 And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone.

Secondly then, taking these two passages together we can see that Paul always knew and said in another place that we are All Workmen Together WITH God. And in the case of Laying the Foundation, he does not suggest that He Alone has laid the Foundation of the Gospel. We know that the Gospel was first preached to Abraham, and all the Prophets and Apostles that Preceded Paul were Workmen Together WITH God as Foundation Layers Together.

After the Foundation is Laid, there is of course the Building or Work that is done upon that foundation.
What Paul continues to say is that we are to take heed how WE Build upon it.
Keep in mind now that it is God that is the "Wise Master Builder", not Paul Himself, and any Glorious and Precious WORK that is Built upon that Perfect Foundation is by the Power and WORK of God Alone.

We can, of ourselves, build Only with Wood, Hay and Stubble. But God Builds THROUGH Christ In Us By His Spirit with Gold Silver and Precious Stones.

Now here, at the following point is where the primary Misunderstanding arises I think.....

We have oft been taught that this....
"14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward."
Is Referencing One Particular Person's Work.

and this.....
"15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire."
Is Referencing Another Particular Person's Work.

But that is not the case at all, no. Paul wrote quite a lot while using Hebraisms or Hebraic structure.
What exists in the text is a Hebraic Repetitious Form of writing.

In a nutshell he is just saying that Anyone's Work that Abides is proof that THOSE Particular WORKS were Done By God
Through Christ in that person as WORKMEN TOGETHER With Him.
And Those WORKS that do Not abide the Fire Will Be Proof that Those Particular WORKS were Done, not By God, but BY THAT SAME Person Only, not assisted by God's Grace, but by any number of wrong Actions.


***************The SAME Person that will Receive Reward IS the SAME Person Who Suffers Loss*****************

The Text is not describing Two Separate People, As in One who Worked so Well and the Other who "Makes it by the skin of their teeth" so to speak.

Again...

***************The SAME Person that will Receive Reward IS the SAME Person Who Suffers Loss*****************







And We will All happily Suffer the Loss of those things that were not Properly done either through wrong motives or ignorance and have Only Remain those Wonderful and Precious Works That God by His grace Alone WORKS Through us.

I hope this has been helpful.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Ready1 on Tue Jan 20, 2015 1:17 pm

While I would agree that we do not serve specifically for rewards, what do these two scriptures allude to?

Rom 8:17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

1Co 2:9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.


To be a joint heir means that whatever the Father has in store for the Son, he has in store for us. And our imagination is to earthly to have the capability to even come close to understanding or imagining what that means.
Just observing.

E.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Sonbeam on Tue Jan 20, 2015 6:27 pm

***************The SAME Person that will Receive Reward IS the SAME Person Who Suffers Loss*****************

The Text is not describing Two Separate People, As in One who Worked so Well and the Other who "Makes it by the skin of their teeth" so to speak.

Again...

***************The SAME Person that will Receive Reward IS the SAME Person Who Suffers Loss*****************




Hi ST,
I agree with you that, according to what the passage says, the same person who gets rewards is the same person who suffers loss. That is why I said that in that case, all Christians will suffer loss for no one will be able to claim that everything they will have done in this life will have been done in the Spirit.

But the comments I’ve made so far have been regarding what the passage says, not what I believe. In other words, I disagree with the idea that Christians will be judged for any works or suffer any loss.

I think we have to look at the whole counsel of scripture and consider this one passage in view of what Christ has said and what Paul himself said in his other epistles concerning the conditions or stipulations Christians are under in the New Covenant.

Here are just a couple of the many scriptures that speak about no works being required for salvation, and I have not come across one of these scriptures that also adds “though special works are necessary for rewards.”


John 6: 28 Then they asked him, “What must we do to do the works God requires?” 29 Jesus answered, “The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent.”

Matt 11:28 “Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. 29 Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. 30 For my yoke is easy and my burden is light.”

Rom 3:27 Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. Because of what law? The law that requires works? No, because of the law that requires faith. 28 For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from the works of the law.


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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby shorttribber on Tue Jan 20, 2015 6:34 pm

Sonbeam wrote:But the comments I’ve made so far have been regarding what the passage says, not what I believe. In other words, I disagree with the idea that Christians will be judged for any works or suffer any loss.


The works are not required For Salvation ,they are only the Proof of it. I hope you understand that the "Loss" Suffered will be What we desire......What remains is Christ's Work IN us.

In other words....Zero Salvation BY Our Works.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Sonbeam on Tue Jan 20, 2015 6:38 pm

Ready1 wrote:While I would agree that we do not serve specifically for rewards, what do these two scriptures allude to?

Rom 8:17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

1Co 2:9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.


To be a joint heir means that whatever the Father has in store for the Son, he has in store for us. And our imagination is to earthly to have the capability to even come close to understanding or imagining what that means.


Great scriptures Ready1!

I believe everything the Lord has in store for us will be freely given requiring no special works to merit them. I see no qualifying phrase in the above scriptures that states that.

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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby keithareilly on Mon Feb 16, 2015 12:39 pm

CorporalJohnny,

You know I don't see any reward in the parable.
I see a God who makes the same promise to all men. Just because some brothers and sisters come to the field a little later, they still get what we all get. I see God telling us to rejoice in the salvation of those who come at the end of the day instead of complaining that they did not work as hard for the kingdom as those who were brought in early.

I don't think this parable is about rewards at all.
I think it is about the generosity of God and our sometimes wrong attitudes toward His generosity. I think we too often think we are entitled to things to which we are not entitled and we believe we have earned things we have not earned. The early workers were unhappy because they mistaken believed they earned something they had not earned. Its about attitude not rewards.

Keith
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Keeping Alert on Mon Feb 16, 2015 4:32 pm

I don't think the following verses have been discussed... So I will just bring them up for consideration....

Matthew 6:1 "Be careful not to do your 'acts of righteousness' before men, to be seen by them. If you do, you will have no reward from your Father in heaven.

2 "So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honoured by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full. 3 But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing, 4 so that your giving may be in secret. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.

Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour.

πατερ δοξασον σου το ονομα
Father, glorify thy name.

Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby keithareilly on Mon Feb 16, 2015 5:39 pm

KA,

Still about attitudes.
Are we looking for the approval of men or are we looking for approval from God. What is our attitude or motivation? Still issues of the heart. First, clean the inside of the cup then outside will be clean also. Jesus is talking about issues of the heart here.

Keith
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Keeping Alert on Mon Feb 16, 2015 8:45 pm

Keith,

I totally agree with you. But that does not mean there are no rewards... The passage is indeed talking about heart attitudes... Have the right attitude and your Father in Heaven will reward you...

Paraphrasing "Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you."... I think it could read "Then your Father, who sees that you have done all things with the right attitude, will reward you."

KA
Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour.

πατερ δοξασον σου το ονομα
Father, glorify thy name.

Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby keithareilly on Tue Feb 17, 2015 8:43 am

KA,

I get that. I just think the reward part is about God rewards also.
One does not have to choose between the rewards of men and no rewards.
The choice is rewards from men or rewards from God.
With this in mind, one cannot say there is no point in working for God as He does not reward.
The choice is not work for temporary rewards or no rewards.
He does reward, so we either work for the things that last or work for the things that are temporary.
With that in mind, what we work for reveals our heart.


Keith
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Re: Rewards in heaven...

Postby Keeping Alert on Tue Feb 17, 2015 4:54 pm

keithareilly wrote:KA,

I get that. I just think the reward part is about God rewards also.
One does not have to choose between the rewards of men and no rewards.
The choice is rewards from men or rewards from God.
With this in mind, one cannot say there is no point in working for God as He does not reward.
The choice is not work for temporary rewards or no rewards.
He does reward, so we either work for the things that last or work for the things that are temporary.
With that in mind, what we work for reveals our heart.


Keith


I agree :)
Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say? Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour.

πατερ δοξασον σου το ονομα
Father, glorify thy name.

Whether therefore ye eat, or drink, or whatsoever ye do, do all to the glory of God.
Keeping Alert
 
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Joined: Mon Aug 11, 2008 3:48 am


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