Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Discussion and debate not related to prophecy.

Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby Abiding in His Word on Mon Nov 06, 2006 2:52 pm

carchaser wrote:
Ecclesia is the Greek word used in the New Testament to describe the church. It has nothing to do with a religious system or a building. It refers to a called out body of believers made up of individuals. The church is a group of believers with or without a cathedral or building. The idea of going to church has long supplanted this definition. But such a connotation of the word cannot change the definition. The believers themselves are the church.


:a3:

What I'm wondering is, if we didn't have these "shrines," where would believers assemble themselves together. Homes? Parks? How could we ave avoided buildings (churches) in today's society? I don't know the answer to this.
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Where would they assemble?

Postby redeemed1953 on Fri Nov 17, 2006 7:04 am

:armor:
They would, in fact, assemble in homes, parks or whereever they could. Like the First Century church did.

And the ministers would have to get other jobs.

And your money could then be used to take care of the true needs of the church.

:a3:
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Re: Where would they assemble?

Postby Morgan on Sun Nov 19, 2006 1:38 pm

redeemed1953 wrote::armor:
They would, in fact, assemble in homes, parks or whereever they could. Like the First Century church did.

And the ministers would have to get other jobs.

And your money could then be used to take care of the true needs of the church.

:a3:


:a3: I agree with that completely. It would utilize assets much better, it would cause people to be more involved in helping one another in everyday lives and it would rid the church of Sunday only worship only to act like pagans and worshipping money the rest of the week.

I am always saddened to hear someone talk about their attending church every Sunday when the rest of their lives show that they are living in the flesh and are chasing after money and willing to stab another worker in the back to get that promotion, etc.

Sometimes the sterile church buildings have taken away the true purpose behind the Body of Christ.
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Postby daffodyllady on Sat Nov 25, 2006 12:06 pm

The Amish are not perfect, by far... but they do not have church buildings. I do believe this is a good thing for their assemblies. It binds them together greatly, to be dependant on each other to open their homes for one another.

However, the church IS supposed to have ministers to lead the flock. We are NOT supposed to be a bunch of sheep going where ever we want to, willy-nilly, with no leadership. God did set within the church, apostles, prophets, teachers, pastors, evangelists, etc. There was indeed a structure to the leadership of the early church. You cant imagine, can you, that God intended for the church of today to be without any structure of leadership?

However, we do know that when Paul started churches in other places, he instructed for leaders to be ordained from among the natives in each church. Leadership was not to be shipped in from outside the congregation, at least not for a long time. leaders were to be chosen from among them, as Acts says, "Look ye out from among yourselves honest men, of good report, and full of the spirit, and lay hands upon them."

And these men are supposed to be first of all, helpers to watch overthe needs of the widows and orphans among us. Wow. What a concept.
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Ministers

Postby redeemed1953 on Sun Nov 26, 2006 2:26 am

:armor:

Actually, the early church didn't have just one minister. It was sort of a group effort. They met together and (are you ready for this?) depended on the Holy Spirit to lead them.

What a brilliant idea.

99% of what we do on Protestant churches is Catholic in origin. All we are missing is the statues.

:a3:
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Postby brandon on Sun Nov 26, 2006 5:53 am

Here's what Paul has to say about full time leaders of the church:

17 Let the elders who rule well be counted worthy of double honor, especially those who labor in the word and doctrine. 18 For the Scripture says, “You shall not muzzle an ox while it treads out the grain,”[c] and, “The laborer is worthy of his wages.”[d]


My church gives away 30% of all money taken in. As a church, there's a lot of discussion about getting into the Word every day, praying every day, getting involved in a cell group (small group of Christians) to fellowship, worship, and talk about God's word and the message the previous Sunday.

There's nothing wrong with having a church building; in fact, for God to give the funds for such a thing is honorable and good. However, the problem is when the building is the focus of the church.
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby Jiminy Crickets on Fri Jan 01, 2010 12:50 am

Well it may not be long until these churches or buildings that we meet in if you will, are taken away from us and we need to meet in secrecy.
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby Pretzelogical on Fri Jan 01, 2010 8:57 am

God commands what believers are to do:

1 Timothy 4:13
Until I come, give attention to the public reading of Scripture, to exhortation and teaching.


Now, I'd post all the verses where God commands believers to meet in temples or buildings, but God made no such commands. That should be the end of the argument; do as God has commanded.

However, we will look at New Testament examples.
1.) Paul goes into the synagogues to teach the Jews of Jesus their Messiah.
2.) Paul never gathers any group of converts to come into the synagogue.

Why not? The synagogue was like a court house where the law of God was to be studied and applied. However, worship was done at the temple in Jerusalem and in their own homes on the appointed Jewish Feast days. Does a word search at Biblegateway.com of "synagogue" and you will find that most often it is referred to as "their synagogue" and never as God's synagogue. The word is not in the Old Testament at all. Men love to build their own kingdoms.

Acts 18:4 And he was reasoning in the synagogue every Sabbath and trying to persuade Jews and Greeks.
5 But when Silas and Timothy came down from Macedonia, Paul began devoting himself completely to the word, solemnly testifying to the Jews that Jesus was the Christ.
6 But when they resisted and blasphemed, he took out his garments and said to them, "Your blood be on your own heads! I am clean From now on I will go to the Gentiles."
7 Then he left there and [b]went to the house of a man named Titus Justus, a worshiper of God, whose house was next to the synagogue.
8 Crisps, the leader of the synagogue, believed in the Lord with all his household, and many of the Corinthians when they heard were believing and being baptized.
9 And the Lord said to Paul in the night by a vision, "Do not be afraid any longer, but go on speaking and do not be silent;
10 for I am with you, and no man will attack you in order to harm you, for I have many people in this city."
11 And he settled there a year and six months, teaching the word of God among them. [/b]

Acts 20:20-21
-how I did not shrink from declaring to you anything that was profitable, and teaching you publicly and from house to house, solemnly testifying to both Jews and Greeks of repentance toward God and faith in our Lord Jesus Christ.


Acts 19:8
And he entered the synagogue and continued speaking out boldly for three months, reasoning and persuading them about the kingdom of God.


We discussed public preaching at length at this thread:
viewtopic.php?f=29&t=41407&p=372664&hilit=+public+preaching+&sid=7c6a80f66b2b1c60d5b559b781d507f8#p372664

As the great preacher, Spurgeon, said of his day, the assembly had degraded into preaching without praying.

Now think of God's wisdom in commanding us to read the word publicly:
1.) You cannot slowly and without detection make a society secular if you have Christians reading the scriptures aloud in public.
2.) However, if Satan can get the Christians to gather in a "holy huddle" and not in public, then he can secularize the whole town apart from that huddle and not allow the Christians to read the word aloud in public. That is exactly what has happened.
3.) If the word was read publicly in a town, and someone was too offended, they would not choose to live in that town or they would gather together to remove the Christians from the town. The command from Christ is to forget them at that point, and we see Paul doing exactly that.

Brothers, we have disobeyed in building churches and forsaking the public reading of the world. The fruit of our disobedience is a secular society, a deceived assembly, wasted funds, and the salt of the earth is not being sprinkled to preserve and enrich the flavor of people's lives. The seeker-friendly movement, Purpose Driven Life, etc., have brought the secular into the assembly that no longer values praying the word, caring for one another, nor building one another into the temple of Christ.

It was another Nimrod that started building projects and called them churches. Think about what went on in public buildings in scripture? Drama, idol worship, perversion. What went on in the homes of believers? Teaching, praying and caring for one another. We are to be holy (which means separate) because God is Holy. We are commanded to "come out of her" the Great City, the harlot, Babylon the Great, which has a form of godliness, but denies the power there of, and never coming to the knowledge of the truth.


2 Timothy 3
1This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.

2For men shall be lovers of their own selves, covetous, boasters, proud, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy,

3Without natural affection, trucebreakers, false accusers, incontinent, fierce, despisers of those that are good,

4Traitors, heady, highminded, lovers of pleasures more than lovers of God;

5Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away.

6For of this sort are they which creep into houses, and lead captive silly women laden with sins, led away with divers lusts,

7Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby Rich Kelley on Fri Jan 01, 2010 9:10 am

What I'm wondering is, if we didn't have these "shrines," where would believers assemble themselves together. Homes? Parks? How could we avoided buildings (churches) in today's society? I don't know the answer to this.


The only time Christ went to the buildings and shrines of His day was to deliver a message, not be part of the system that was in place. Christ was in the process of destroying the building, and rebuilding it in three days. The rebuilding happened and time has shown that the body of believers have went full circle back to the building. The temple is within the believer, however most today don't know how to operate without the "System".

Accept Christ, be baptized, receive power from on high (the Holy Spirit).

Where 2 or 3 are gathered in My name.

I suspect it is much more simple than we are able to do because of the system we have grown up in. I don't have a good all inclusive answer to the above questions either, however, my path has led me away from the building, and "the system".
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby Abiding in His Word on Fri Jan 01, 2010 9:11 am

Pretzelogical wrote:God commands what believers are to do:

1 Timothy 4:13
Until I come, give attention to the public reading of Scripture, to exhortation and teaching.


So "until I come" is the timeline for that "command?" By the way, the word "public" has been added to the verse, but appears not to have been in the original.

Now, I'd post all the verses where God commands believers to meet in temples or buildings, but God made no such commands. That should be the end of the argument; do as God has commanded.


Yes, it's true that God never commanded a speciic place for NT believers to meet. That's because wherever two or three gather, it's an assembly of believers who are one in Christ. They can do that in a building of any type or outside. It matters not.
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Re: Where would they assemble?

Postby extravagantchristian on Fri Jan 01, 2010 9:22 am

redeemed1953 wrote::armor:
They would, in fact, assemble in homes, parks or whereever they could. Like the First Century church did.

And the ministers would have to get other jobs.

And your money could then be used to take care of the true needs of the church.

:a3:


Hello!

I don't see anything wrong with everyone chipping in to support a designated church building and full time pastor. And here is why, Pastors are paid so that they can make their time available to minister to people, not just the church, but the lost too.

So let's say a young person or whoever was feeling lost and knew that they needed to get right with God, but had some questions about where to start. What if they didn't know any real Christians to turn to? Then they could at least call a church or go there for Godly advice.

That's what I did when I was 21. I was lost and living in sin, I new I needed to repent but I really needed confirmation from someone mature in the faith. So I got out the phone book, called a baptist church that I had been watching on a local TV station, and made an appointment to come in and talk to a pastor. He invited me to come to church that Sunday and that was just the push I needed to turn from my sins cold turkey and start going to church and get baptized.

My point is this:

Sure, we could all hold onto our money and go underground, but we wouldn't be making ourselves more available to the lost, we would become hidden. And where would they turn when they finally decide to obey the calling of the Holy SPirit? They would most likely end up at some Jehovah's witness hall or catholic church trying to find God, because our homes are not open to the public like those other types of churches are.

Tearing down our churches and hiding in homes is not the answer!
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby extravagantchristian on Fri Jan 01, 2010 9:33 am

How is it that the jehovas witnesses and catholics don't mind tithing a measley 10% to support their church, but us "REAL CHRISTIANS" can't trust God enough to take care of our needs and would rather hoard all of our money together and go underground so that we can "take care of the true needs of "THE CHURCH"?

I'm sorry I hate to be so blunt but that's plain selfishness.

The reason why the early church gathered in homes is because they had to, they didn't have cars to collectivly meet in one place. And they didn't have enough members to be able to afford to put a church on ever block and pay a full time pastor. That doesn't mean their is anything wrong with having a building.

I understand that people may be discontent with their average church in America, but don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. We as a church NEED to be able to provide a visable gathering place, that is open and available to the public so that our light can shine and not be hidden in a private home.

Sure we could gather in a park or large tent, but a building makes more sense because we can be there in the rain and snow and not be voulnerable to the weather and bugs. And it also helps to have a room to put your children in so they don't disrupt whoever is preaching and distract away from what God is doing.

What we all need is a REVIVAL. Churches need to change in some ways, but they don't need to be torn down. If we aren't feeling the presence of the Holy Spirit, we can't blame it on our stale church buildings, the churches are stale because WE ARE. Not the other way around.
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby Jiminy Crickets on Fri Jan 01, 2010 9:48 am

extravagantchristian wrote:How is it that the jehovas witnesses and catholics don't mind tithing a measley 10% to support their church, but us "REAL CHRISTIANS" can't trust God enough to take care of our needs and would rather hoard all of our money together and go underground so that we can "take care of the true needs of "THE CHURCH"?

I'm sorry I hate to be so blunt but that's plain selfishness.

Everyone is different and not everyone who is not a catholic or Jehovas witness does that.
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby extravagantchristian on Fri Jan 01, 2010 9:50 am

The Preacher wrote:
extravagantchristian wrote:How is it that the jehovas witnesses and catholics don't mind tithing a measley 10% to support their church, but us "REAL CHRISTIANS" can't trust God enough to take care of our needs and would rather hoard all of our money together and go underground so that we can "take care of the true needs of "THE CHURCH"?

I'm sorry I hate to be so blunt but that's plain selfishness.

Everyone is different and not everyone who is not a catholic or Jehovas witness does that.


Yes but the majority do obviously or they wouldn't have nice church buildings all over every town in america.

If they can give, why can't we?
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby soonverysoon on Fri Jan 01, 2010 10:19 am

In our culture a church building is the center where people gather to worship. To worship from house to house does not even make since. First off how would you know who believes what? How would you find them? It is just a lot more practical to have a building to go to, to worship when there are so many who worship at the same time.

However like everything man becomes greedy and wants bigger, better, richer then the next guy. The reason for the church building gets lost in their greed.

Yet through history the Church building was were people could go to find hope and learn about Jesus. We are not in small villages or towns were everyone knows everyone but cities with thousands. Without the Church buildings letting people know where to go many would have never came to Christ.

Most pastors have a full time job taking care of the things that go on in the church. They must study for lessons and sermons.Do visits, weddings, funerals, canceling and take care of any number of other things we never even worry about. Some not all but some pastors with a large Church family really do not have time for a full time job. Others who do have time may just take advantage of free money. Some who have a large Church may get paid more then they should. But still the system we have in place now is better then no Church buildings to go to are no pastors. It is better to pay a pastor then there be no time for a pastor to study and pray and do the hundred others things needed because his time is taken up with just trying to make a living.

To get rid of the Church building I think would not be helpful and would even cause great harm. But a change in how we use what God has blessed us with would be very good. For example we should stop letting the buildings just set there all week not being used. The doors could be open to the homeless. Schools, daycare, food lines, ect. any number of helpful needed uses could come from the use of the Church buildings when they are not being use to worship in.

soonverysoon
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby extravagantchristian on Fri Jan 01, 2010 10:21 am

One more thing I would like to add is that God has used the ministry of Godly pastors on the radio in such a big way in my life. And think of how many unbelievers are touched by the word of God when they come across a good sermon on the radio. None of that would even be possible if those pastors didn't belong to a church that tithed faithfully.

So do you honestly think it is God's will that we collectivly leave our churches to gather in our homes, making ourselves less available to the public in more ways that one? Just for the sake of being able to pool our money and "take care of the needs of the church"?
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby burien1 on Fri Jan 01, 2010 1:50 pm

7And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

These apostles were the foundation of the Church. JESUS being the chief cornerstone. If gathering together with 12 or more people every Sunday was good enough for them, I certainly don`t mind paying for a building to gather together in. It beats a snowy cornfield any day of the week. That`s not to say I`m not edified when I meet with just 2 or 3 other Christians. It`s like being on a small intimate little board with other Christians. You are blessed in some ways there. But on a bigger board like this, you are also blessed in so many other ways, including learning not to be so easily offended. Both gatherings can be great blessings.

There is certainly more friction in larger groups, but I for one have learned a lot from adversity, and especially from people who have been rotten to me. Patience and love doesn`t come easily for me, and the good Lord in his wisdom, has put some truly abrasive people in my path. And I thank him for it. I`ve learned so much more that way, then I would`ve learned in a lifetime.

A perfect Church doesn`t exist yet. We`re still living in sinfull flesh. And as long as we are still here, we are still growing on the vine. And all vines need pruning now and then. Being in a larger group setting, really does give more practice for patience, forgiveness, submitting to one another, and really learning to love people as Christ loves the Church. Being around other Christians in a larger group, has also taught me to have to submit to Christ even more, and die to my own wants and desires. If I was on my own, it would be so easy to slack off and just ignore someone who had wronged me. Or to have nothing to do with someone who lied about me , or gossiped about a friend. But within a larger group, I have to deal with it , as the Bible instructs us to. And I learn and grow that way. Iron sharpens iron. And I believe I`m being sharpened a whole lot more, the more Christians I`m around.

And of course, that`s just my humble opinion. And if I don`1t make sense, say a prayer for me. I`m sick and my head hurts terribly. :goodnight:
Psalm 119:105; Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby Jiminy Crickets on Fri Jan 01, 2010 2:15 pm

This is not really a big deal. You can gather and worship in a big building called a church, a small building called a house, or in a park or anywhere. It doesn't matter, as long as we are gathering in his Holy name to worship and hear the word of the Lord somewhere. That is all the matters. Let's keep it simple, its not all that complicated. :grin:
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby Pretzelogical on Fri Jan 01, 2010 8:05 pm

First off how would you know who believes what? How would you find them? It is just a lot more practical to have a building to go to, to worship when there are so many who worship at the same time.


:wink: Let me know what Bible story showed God's amazing ways to be practical.
That is not the God we worship. God is amazing in bringing believers together to do the good works He has prepared in advance for us to do! The Holy Spirit has brought beautiful believers into my life over choosing which brand of coffee at Walmart, buying clothes for the needy at Goodwill, leaving a devotional and a big tip for a waitress, chatting in the bleachers at kids' ballgames...the list is too huge to even begin to name all that God has done to bring believers together outside of the church building! He will do His good work when we obey the command to read the word, preach the word boldy, teach house to house, care for one another, and walk by faith. "I am not ashamed of the gospel..." so people around me hear it!

On the other hand, at the church building, I have no idea who are the saved ones, and who is there to make business contacts or just attending to get their "felt needs" met, like having an hour of relaxation with the baby in the nursery. (Very understandable, by the way.) Could these things be done in a home? Of course. I don't know who is a manipulating user, and who is a praying repentant believer with needs I can assist to relieve. I don't even know who has a good singing voice. The place has become so pastor-driven, we have no time to get to know one another. The band is so loud you cannot even hear yourself sing, let alone bask in the beauty of hearing the saints sing to their LORD. It is heart-breaking to see people in the congregation unemployed and needing assistance having to turn to the state for the help Christians are supposed to give. Meanwhile, the church just bought more lighting for the stage while the people wait for the church to help them. I have no idea what happens to the money we give to help the needy in our church. They just stay needy and lose faith from being abandoned. It was not like this in the past. If your church is persevering in the faith, be thankful and be warned of the apostasy that is to come!

Believers who meet in homes, grow close, meet one another's needs, serve alongside one another, and have an effect on those with whom they work and play. Some believers who meet in homes, also meet in the church building. The cults know the effectiveness of this and use it too well.

The lost people who are seeking God will see you where you work, shop, play and walk the dog. They will seek out the believer who has a network of friends who are serving one another. It is maddening and saddening to me that EC did not know people like this and had to call a church from the phone book. We are to be salt and light. People should be able to tell who is a genuine believer. Genuine believers are in the world, but not of it. Where the salt is, things are not decaying; but without the salt, things decay and stink.

Matthew 5:16 "...let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven."

Obey Jesus command to shine, and be amazed at what God will do! (I'll start another thread about it so we can encourage one another.)

good sermon on the radio. None of that would even be possible if those pastors didn't belong to a church that tithed faithfully.


Though many pastors on the radio are supported by a church, many are not. It is common to have it be a separate ministry. Remarkably, J. Vernon McGee quit being the pastor of a church because believers came to him saying they thought the LORD wanted him to preach on the radio. He continues to be a tremendous blessing to many even though he has passed away. You don't need a church to support your ministry. You need believers moved by the Holy Spirit to support the ministry. Many of whom go to a church building; though many no longer can find a building that obeys the word.

Real church for us is being in the Gideons. Gideons are business men, not pastors, who are moved by the Spirit. 100% of donations go to the printing of the Bibles. Everything else is done by the Gideons and their wives - all volunteers. The testimonies of the salvation of souls from people finding that Bible stuffed away somewhere since gradeschool are amazing! And the Gideons meet in public places. The enemy wants Gideons to meet in churches, but instead, the Gideons see the importance of taking a stand to allow Christians to meet in public like any other organization. It is becoming more difficult as "freedom from religion" pushes the believers into the church buildings and out of the public eye.

One more thing, was it the disciples who came together to break bread on Sunday? Or was it all the believers? Perhpas it was a leadership meeting to keep apostasy away? In Ezra, we see the elders gather to agree on what the word meant, and then it is preached with each elder making sure their group was in agreement with the teaching the elders agreed upon previously. If anyone would not agree to what the elders taught, they were put out. That is how things look in the New Testament too. Each elder should have a group he knows well. That cannot all be done on Sunday morning. The elders knew the people because they met in their homes.
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby daffodyllady on Wed Feb 10, 2010 8:50 pm

*raises hand quietly*
Might I speak a word of testimony here?
I belong to a local body of Mennonite believers. By becoming a member, I have taken the responsibility of being willing to approach or be approached by any other believer in the body about any subject of concern.
Our local body of mennonite believers at first did not have a church building to meet in. Meetings were held in homes, until the group became too large to gather in a home comfortably. We had a choice: split into two groups, or find a building to meet in. We began to rent a small church that had closed its doors. Eventually, the group became too large for that building, and bought land and built a very plain structure to meet in. The building serves many purposes. As a group, we hire a tutor for any homeschooled children from our group, if the parents need help in teaching them. We currently have about a dozen students in our "school". The school meets in our church building. We also have a women's ministry which my 85 yr old mother spearheads- turning scrap cloth into warm comforters to send to disaster areas. We put out about 10 a month. We meet in the church building. Anytime any of us has a family reunion of any size, we know we can meet in the church.

Our pastor is not paid a salary. We know this is debatable. There may be some Scripture which would support a salaried pastorship. However, we have seen such serious abuses of such a system, that we feel it is better that our pastors hold a job, and we give them a once a month offering to split among themselves, if they choose to. Yes, we have a plural ministry team, all chosen by vote and lot from among us. We know their lives before we entrust such a calling to them. We currently have 3 ministers. One retired pastor, one pastor, and a deacon. Often, they choose not to keep that offering for themselves, but rather give it to a family within the church who is in worse shape than themselves. Our tithes and offerings belong to the church body, not the ministry team. They are given to missions, to the upkeep of our very plain building, to needy Christians, or to pay the school tutor. This year, the tutor chose not to recieve payment for her work, but pled with us to rather give that money to missions.

From our group, we have 5 families on the mission field. They live in Central and South America, and they work hard. We keep in constant contact with them, and keep them in our prayers.

I love my little church. I have been a member of other kinds of churches, and I can say I have never known a better church life than this group offers. I do not claim that all Mennonite churches are like this one. In fact, I suspect that not many measure up.

I wish each of you could experience such a good church.
Daffodyllady
Come ye out from among them, and be ye separate, and touch not the unclean thing, and I will recieve you... Abstain from all appearance of evil...Without holiness shall no man see the Lord.
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby ampersand on Wed Feb 10, 2010 9:29 pm

That is a wonderful testimony, daffodyllady! You are blessed.
Thank you for sharing.

&
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby kazbo on Thu Feb 11, 2010 10:33 pm

Yet through history the Church building was were people could go to find hope and learn about Jesus.

Throughout history (and I'm not sure how many years back you're going here) the church was mostly Catholic, and people went because they were duty-bound to; they learned of the Catholic Christ, and Mary, and the saints, and the Pope, etc. Not necessarily the biblical Jesus.

We are not in small villages or towns were everyone knows everyone but cities with thousands.


True. But we are placed within smaller areas within those larger areas. Every city has its "neighborhoods"; all of us know a circle of people, both in our personal lives and at work, who are our particular community within the larger city community. Your neighbors, your coworkers, your mailman - these are your village.

Without the Church buildings letting people know where to go many would have never came to Christ.


Sure they would have. The Holy Spirit is not dependent on any church building to bring anyone to Christ. He does it by directly working in people's hearts and by using us, his people, wherever we are.
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby kazbo on Thu Feb 11, 2010 10:38 pm

My church gives away 30% of all money taken in.


And that's commendable, Brandon. But that means 70% of it being used to support the church, its staff, and its programs. Imagine 100% of it being given away, shared among the church members as they have need. Wow.
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby Jiminy Crickets on Thu Feb 11, 2010 11:55 pm

kazbo wrote:
My church gives away 30% of all money taken in.


And that's commendable, Brandon. But that means 70% of it being used to support the church, its staff, and its programs. Imagine 100% of it being given away, shared among the church members as they have need. Wow.

Yea, that's just about what we do at our church. I mean we have very little money. Enough to pay the church's bills and the rest pretty much goes to people in need. My brother and myself are pastors there and we don't get paid for it we just do it to serve the Lord. :grin:
God Speed, Crick crick!
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby sands on Sat Feb 13, 2010 1:01 am

Folks, there are lots of false teachers with lots of subtle false doctrines...That's why it is so very important for us to go straight to the word of God and let Him Teach us...


James 1:"21Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls. 22But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves."

John 6:63"It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life."


1 John 2: 26"These things have I written unto you concerning them that seduce you. 27But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him."
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Re: Christianity – The Religion that is Not

Postby extravagantchristian on Sat Feb 13, 2010 1:21 am

Jiminy Crickets wrote:
kazbo wrote:
My church gives away 30% of all money taken in.


And that's commendable, Brandon. But that means 70% of it being used to support the church, its staff, and its programs. Imagine 100% of it being given away, shared among the church members as they have need. Wow.

Yea, that's just about what we do at our church. I mean we have very little money. Enough to pay the church's bills and the rest pretty much goes to people in need. My brother and myself are pastors there and we don't get paid for it we just do it to serve the Lord. :grin:


That sounds like a great idea, helping people in need... verses hoarding the money to "take care of the needs of the church body". Something I have felt really convicted about lately is, how can I in good conscious hang onto my money to spend on my wants when there are so many people starving in the world? How can we as humans, LET ALONE Christians build our kingdom here on earth, be it flat screen TV's, brand new cars, nice homes, whatever, knowing that there are millions of people going to bed hungry each night?! And it's been this way for how many years? If we all just pitched in and gave out of our excess, we could EASILY feed all of the starving people but NOOOOO, and we never will. I can only imagine how disappointed God is with us. We should really all be ashamed. And as long as there are starving people on this planet I will not own a 6 figure home, no matter how much money I make! How could I ever stand before God and explain to Him that I just didn't care enough to feed the poor? I mean I did, but just not enough to give up my nice things. I'm not trying to preach to anyone else, if anything I'm trying to motivate myself into doing what I know is right, I mean really, did I NEED that $100 bed spread I bought last week? I already have 4 in the closet I don't use. How can I cover up with that every night knowing that there are little children sleeping in cold tents or whatever who had to eat dirt cookies that day?! I just can't believe how sick and twisted and cold hearted we are as humans!

lol sorry I just had to get that off my chest.
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