2018..

Discussion not limited to prophecy.

Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:12 pm

Jericho wrote:
shorttribber wrote:
mrgravyard49 wrote:Where does Psalm payout in all this.
Essentially the buildup to it is ongoing, and God will show the heathen who's Boss during the 3.5, and with His final proof to the world of his power at Armageddon.

It can't come soon enough.
:armor:

:a3:


mrgravyard49 wrote:Next 100 days should be Very . interesting

:a3:
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Re: 2018..

Postby mrgravyard49 on Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:46 pm

Did you know when Trump declaration of Jerusalem was 70 years from Truman recognized Israel. ?
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Fri Jan 12, 2018 7:49 pm

mrgravyard49 wrote:Did you know when Trump declaration of Jerusalem was 70 years from Truman recognized Israel. ?

No, I didn't. just knew it was 70 years around April....didn't know the exact days
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

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Re: 2018..

Postby mrgravyard49 on Fri Jan 12, 2018 8:13 pm

Zechariah 1:11-17 . Was given on 517. 70 years after the destruction of the 1st temple. Which is the Hebrew year of 3244. 3244 -5778 this year. You get 2534. Search 2534 in relation to the Bible you get the Hebrew word Chemah. CHEMAH=Wrath. 24th of Shebat is February 9th. February 9th. Interesting. .
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Re: 2018..

Postby mrgravyard49 on Fri Jan 12, 2018 8:32 pm

What event starts on February 9th?
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Fri Jan 12, 2018 8:42 pm

mrgravyard49 wrote:What event starts on February 9th?

I don't know, sounds interesting though. Same with the 3244,3244 :thinking:
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

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Re: 2018..

Postby mrgravyard49 on Fri Jan 12, 2018 8:50 pm

Winter Olympics.
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Fri Jan 12, 2018 9:59 pm

mrgravyard49 wrote:Winter Olympics.


Oh, ok. Guess you can tell I'm not too much looking forward to the Olympics :mrgreen:
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

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Re: 2018..

Postby Exit40 on Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:26 am

Regarding satan being thrown out of Heaven, that happened when Christ entered Heaven, the Heaven of the Throne Room where satan had accused us in front of God, right after His Resurrection. See, there was this Court case going on before God from early in our history, satan accusing and Christ advocating. Christ won the case with His blood, God our Father having hidden this from satan as to the real meaning of it. At that point satan loses his case and is cast out of the Heaven where the Throne Room is, down to the Heaven of the firmament right above us here in corporal time. When Scripture says there is a war in Heaven, this is where it is. The Gates of Heaven will withstand this assault, and at a predetermined time of God's choosing satan will be cast to earth, corporal time, for the final 3,5 years of the Daniel 9:24-27 Prophecy. This war in Heaven also includes satan walking about seeking to devour whom he can. This is my opinion of the Scriptures relating to all of this. Read them for yourself to see how the confusion is cleared up regarding satan and his fate.

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Re: 2018..

Postby mrgravyard49 on Sat Jan 13, 2018 8:42 am

Just read on debka that instead of just going after issis in Syria trump is now working with Israel against Iran am others while Iran and russia are moving more troops into syria. . This really coming to a head. Yea 2018 is the year. .
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Re: 2018..

Postby WOODHENOT3 on Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:18 pm

shorttribber wrote:
mrgravyard49 wrote:Ok, I asked before, what does everyone think happens to America during ezekiel 38. IMHO I think 38 happens early in the 7 years.

I believe we will be attacked at the same time that Israel is attacked. I believe the reference to those who dwell in safety, having neither bars nor gates, refer to the USA, not Israel...the Unwalled villages, is the USA, the place where all the cattle and goods are in the Midst of the Land, is the USA....we will be attacked at the "Same Time".

I do want to add though....not a seven year timeframe after that....3.5 years only.


That description seem to fit many countries IMO....., such as Canada or some European countries.... hey, what about Russia or ...
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Sat Jan 13, 2018 1:32 pm

WOODHENOT3 wrote:
shorttribber wrote:
mrgravyard49 wrote:Ok, I asked before, what does everyone think happens to America during ezekiel 38. IMHO I think 38 happens early in the 7 years.

I believe we will be attacked at the same time that Israel is attacked. I believe the reference to those who dwell in safety, having neither bars nor gates, refer to the USA, not Israel...the Unwalled villages, is the USA, the place where all the cattle and goods are in the Midst of the Land, is the USA....we will be attacked at the "Same Time".

I do want to add though....not a seven year timeframe after that....3.5 years only.


That description seem to fit many countries IMO....., such as Canada or some European countries.... hey, what about Russia or ...
The description may fit other countries, yes, but none of them has stood as a constant Friend and supporter of Israel, usually, than the USA.
None of the others would be as important to eliminate on the world stage either.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby mrgravyard49 on Sun Jan 14, 2018 8:40 am

Been thinking about your 31/2 year trib. St. Problem,, Daniel 9:27 days he will put an end to sacrifices and offerings. Where is the temple?? See I see us very close to the start of the 7 years you see us close to the middle right? Need a temple fast for you.. :wink:
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Sun Jan 14, 2018 9:49 am

mrgravyard49 wrote:Been thinking about your 31/2 year trib. St. Problem,, Daniel 9:27 days he will put an end to sacrifices and offerings. Where is the temple?? See I see us very close to the start of the 7 years you see us close to the middle right? Need a temple fast for you.. :wink:


There is no problem mrgraveyard. Dan. 9:27 does not speak of an antichrist putting a stop to animal sacrifices in a future temple.
Jesus Christ is the one who caused the Sacrifice and Offering to Cease, Forever. Daniel 9:27 is speaking of Christ and what He has already done during his earthly ministry. It does not speak of a future antichrist who will make a "Peace treaty" .
The first 3 1/2 years of the 70th week has already been fulfilled by Christ himself. All that remains future is 3 1/2 years of great tribulation.

have you read my position before thoroughly? if not....below is the link to that thread....

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=57088

And so that you know, the word "Temple" on a Wing "OF the Temple" is not in the original Hebrew.....that has been added in to Modern Versions.
Jesus Caused the Sacrifices to Cease by the Sacrifice of Himself....and Not in a Temple....but Outside the Camp...on the Cross.

There will be no third Temple built during the tribulation. There will only be a whole bunch of very Bewildered Modern Christians Clamoring for one, and Wondering What to make of everything!

You will not be confused with them if you take the time to read and understand what shorttriber is saying in this regard.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby mrgravyard49 on Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:14 am

But you do know every thing for a 3rd temple is ready, Everything! ! Why go to all that trouble? You do realize you are pretty much alone on your thinking on this..
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:20 am

mrgravyard49 wrote:But you do know every thing for a 3rd temple is ready, Everything! ! Why go to all that trouble? You do realize you are pretty much alone on your thinking on this..


Oh yeah, I know that Israel and most Modern Evangelical Christians are all clamoring for one. Won't happen though. I'm not even close to being alone on the matter, oh no...not even now in these modern days, there's lots of shorttribbers out there.

Used to be though, before modern dispensationalist ideas, that Almost all Christians believe as I do , Basically..... I'm just much more Historic in my view, than Moderns.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby WOODHENOT3 on Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:24 am

Shorttribber,

Do you believe the coming AC because of the Oct 21st SIGN?
Why would you give a window frame from Oct to April?
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:38 am

WOODHENOT3 wrote:Shorttribber,

Do you believe the coming AC because of the Oct 21st SIGN?
Why would you give a window frame from Oct to April?


Because of the 70 Jubilees primarily. And the proximity in time to that sign....yes. But also other reasons on the world scene.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby mrgravyard49 on Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:47 am

Ok. St. Let's say your right. 1st. Please tell me in Jesus name we are raptured out before the 2ed half. 2ed. Where does the AOD happen?
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:09 pm

mrgravyard49 wrote:Ok. St. Let's say your right. 1st. Please tell me in Jesus name we are raptured out before the 2ed half. 2ed. Where does the AOD happen?

The AOD will begin the second half of the 70th week. That will also be the time that Salvation and Strength comes into the Body of Christ as never before in history....and all who continue to trust and believe in our Mighty God will not fear. This will be the Second half of the Confirmation of the Abrahamic Covenant....and those who walk in and are a Participant in that Confirmation will be Strengthened and Confirmed until the end.

if you fear the time to come, stop it....fear brings with it, torment. That torment is not of God. Faith is of God.
We will have the SAME Fearless Testimony that Christ had on this earth, we will be One Voice with Him and His Power.

Then, after we have finished our Testimony, after 1,260 days....sometime after that God will pour out his wrath on those who would not believe Our report, our Testimony. We will be removed from the earth at the rapture AFTER we have finished our testimony, and Before God pours out His Wrath....that would occur sometime between the 1,260 and the 1,290 days (that Last 30 day period) of the great tribulation.

Again, there is no need to Fear.... :banana: God's got this! :banana:
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:14 pm

:banana: Because this is post number 70 :banana:

:banana: :banana: :banana: Jubilee :banana: :banana: :banana:

We win!!!!! :banana:
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby mrgravyard49 on Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:24 pm

No no no. Ain't going to happen, I'm not sticking around for no more. My life has been a hell I wouldn't wish on hitler. . Drunk mother died when I was 10 I have had 30 operations. Son turned to drugs 16 years ago, wife had stroke 4 years ago. I have her and him here. Every one has issues, I get it. But no one tops me. I will do more research but, na if true I'm done. Jesus paid all sins..
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:39 pm

mrgravyard49 wrote:No no no. Ain't going to happen, I'm not sticking around for no more. My life has been a hell I wouldn't wish on hitler. . Drunk mother died when I was 10 I have had 30 operations. Son turned to drugs 16 years ago, wife had stroke 4 years ago. I have her and him here. Every one has issues, I get it. But no one tops me. I will do more research but, na if true I'm done. Jesus paid all sins..

Jesus did pay for all sins, That's not what this time is about for the saints (Some kind of punishment or Judgment on His Children, no)....and I can't begin to know how you've been hurt, all I know is that God has More power and healing for you than you realize!
The time to come is when Jesus is On Our Side in a more tangible way than ever before....I know He will show you that.

Your hope is Him, HIM, not the Rapture....HE Is Your HOPE...and He will prove Himself to you.

Power and Peace in your spirit is coming your way, more than you ever realized before.

God is Faithful, and He will Do it.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby extravagantchristian on Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:47 pm

Even though we don't hear about it in mainstream media, Israel has been striking in Syria more during this past year than ever before. Since Hezbollah and Iran have been given more of a foothold over there. Things could escalate quickly.
Matthew 1:22
So all this was done that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the Lord through the prophets
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:52 pm

Just so you know mrgraveyard, I gotta gun for now for a few hours....just in case you post and I don't respond....you'll just know I'm out for a while and away from the computer.

:praying:
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby extravagantchristian on Sun Jan 14, 2018 12:52 pm

mrgravyard49 wrote:No no no. Ain't going to happen, I'm not sticking around for no more. My life has been a hell I wouldn't wish on hitler. . Drunk mother died when I was 10 I have had 30 operations. Son turned to drugs 16 years ago, wife had stroke 4 years ago. I have her and him here. Every one has issues, I get it. But no one tops me. I will do more research but, na if true I'm done. Jesus paid all sins..


Hang in there man, you don't want to miss what Gods going to do in the lastdays, it's going to be amazing and he's going to use us to speak the truth to those who are being deceived.
Last edited by extravagantchristian on Sun Jan 14, 2018 3:36 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: 2018..

Postby mrgravyard49 on Sun Jan 14, 2018 1:21 pm

I'm fine, Thanks, just freeked me out about having to go thru trib. But we won't we are NOT appointed to wrath.. So no matter we won't be here. . Yup.. Very soon to go home, be it 7 or 31/2 years!!!
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:55 pm

mrgravyard49 wrote:I'm fine, Thanks, just freeked me out about having to go thru trib. But we won't we are NOT appointed to wrath.. So no matter we won't be here. . Yup.. Very soon to go home, be it 7 or 31/2 years!!!


I didn't say we were going through any wrath at all. We will not. as I said ......
shorttribber wrote:Then, after we have finished our Testimony, after 1,260 days....sometime after that God will pour out his wrath on those who would not believe Our report, our Testimony. We will be removed from the earth at the rapture AFTER we have finished our testimony, and Before God pours out His Wrath....that would occur sometime between the 1,260 and the 1,290 days (that Last 30 day period) of the great tribulation.


Do you understand what I'm saying about that time mrgraveyard? We will be gone to Christ BEFORE God's wrath. God's wrath will be outpoured sometime in the final 30 days....After we are gone to Christ.

and I'm glad you're fine....very glad about that. :grin:
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby WOODHENOT3 on Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:26 pm

Hi Shorttribber,
I was researching the '70 Jubilees' and there are many websites with many crazy ideas... they predicted the end back in 2016 and nothing happened, then predicted the End in 2017 and nothing happened and as for 2018, what are you calculating 70 Jubilees from? 1948 when Israel became a country?
I'm interested in knowing where you're getting these ideas.... :) thanks....
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:53 pm

WOODHENOT3 wrote:Hi Shorttribber,
I was researching the '70 Jubilees' and there are many websites with many crazy ideas... they predicted the end back in 2016 and nothing happened, then predicted the End in 2017 and nothing happened and as for 2018, what are you calculating 70 Jubilees from? 1948 when Israel became a country?
I'm interested in knowing where you're getting these ideas.... :) thanks....

I haven't done anything precise simply because there are obvious variations that run from 2016-2018.
The things people put together about Jubilees have the most common denominator of "the rapture". I have been very clear that the jubilees are not connected to a pretrib rapture....that's what most of the excitement has revolved around.

now, what I have said is that the Jubilees Should coincide with the AOD, and the second half of the confirmation of the Covenant.

The Covenant "The Abrahamic Covenant" that places us all in God's Grace and Power, by Faith.....just as All the Children of Abraham, the Household of God. Christ began that confirmation by confirming the promises to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. Just as Paul said,"Christ, a minister of the Gospel, to confirm the promises made to the fathers."

Now, soon, He will Finish the Confirmation of the Promises made to them, and Free Us (Jubilee) from the Bondages of Our Division, Shortcomings and Ineffectiveness we have proven ourselves Slaves Still to our own Fleshly Ways.
Soon Christ will confirm who the "Household of God" is. He will Testify to the World that He is Mighty to Save, Mighty to Deliver and Mighty to Direct our ministry in Him in Unity and Power that can ONLY Come from Him, and no other.


It will not be an "Us Thing", it will be a "Him Only Thing".....He will do it. He will Strengthen (Confirm) us till the End.

I can not even imagine where 70 Jubilees could possibly come and go without any event at all.


Could I be wrong? oh yeah, but soon enough we will know.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby WOODHENOT3 on Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:28 am

I honestly think that Daniels chapter 9 is fulfilled and whats left is the Book of Revelation which is 3 1/2 years....
I believe we will be here to the very LAST DAY... God is Graceful and Merciful and I believe He is going to prolong the days for more people to be saved.... I keep thinking of Sodom and Gomorah.... God would not destroy it if there were one righteous person... so to speak.... I don't think God is going to allow the End Time roll in just yet....

All the numbers and ideas are convincing, but there are thousands of IDEAS out there....

The mostimportant thing is, if the AoD does reveal, then we know we are here and from that point, we will be here for 1260 days for sure, I believe we will be here the whole Great Tribulation of 1260 days and after that, we do not know the day and hour of His coming... I honestly believe Christians will be gathered LAST, not first... like the parable of the Tares and the Wheat...Tares are taken out first, not the wheat.....

if your ideas are correct ST, then I am READY!!!
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Re: 2018..

Postby mark s on Mon Jan 15, 2018 9:52 am

shorttribber wrote: Used to be though, before modern dispensationalist ideas, that Almost all Christians believe as I do , Basically..... I'm just much more Historic in my view, than Moderns.


Hi ST,

I'd have to know more about your view, as you've played it very close to the chest of the years. But from what I understand of your view, and from the study I've done of the historical teachings of Christianity, I'd really have to challenge you on this point.

I can't agree with this statement. But perhaps I'm misunderstanding what you thing.

The classic teachings of Christianity over the centuries has been either post trib / post wrath, moving towards amillennialism. At least to my understanding.

Much love,
Mark
ειπεν αυτη ο ιησους εγω ειμι η αναστασις και η ζωη ο πιστευων εις εμε καν αποθανη ζησεται
. . . saying to her Jesus, I AM the resurrection and the life, the one believing into Me even dying shall live . . .
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Mon Jan 15, 2018 10:26 am

mark s wrote:The classic teachings of Christianity over the centuries has been either post trib / post wrath, moving towards amillennialism. At least to my understanding.

That's true....I'm Post Trib Essentially (excepting only the last thirty days {That I believe is reserved for God's Wrath}). That's why I said in my statement, "Basically".

Also, I primarily intended to mention my agreement with the historics where Daniel 9:27 is concerned.
I was answering mainly that issue, but I should have been more specific about it.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby mark s on Mon Jan 15, 2018 12:06 pm

shorttribber wrote:
mark s wrote:The classic teachings of Christianity over the centuries has been either post trib / post wrath, moving towards amillennialism. At least to my understanding.

That's true....I'm Post Trib Essentially (excepting only the last thirty days {That I believe is reserved for God's Wrath}). That's why I said in my statement, "Basically".


OK, so you are post trib / pre-wrath, which is not an historical viewpoint. The earliest references to pre-wrath that I am aware of were in the 1980's or so, am I remembering this right?

Much love,
Mark
ειπεν αυτη ο ιησους εγω ειμι η αναστασις και η ζωη ο πιστευων εις εμε καν αποθανη ζησεται
. . . saying to her Jesus, I AM the resurrection and the life, the one believing into Me even dying shall live . . .
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Re: 2018..

Postby mark s on Mon Jan 15, 2018 12:11 pm

mrgravyard49 wrote:Zechariah 1:11-17 . Was given on 517. 70 years after the destruction of the 1st temple. Which is the Hebrew year of 3244. 3244 -5778 this year. You get 2534. Search 2534 in relation to the Bible you get the Hebrew word Chemah. CHEMAH=Wrath. 24th of Shebat is February 9th. February 9th. Interesting. .


Hi mrgravyard49,

Is this date setting with Strong's numbers? I've not seen that before.

Much love,
Mark
ειπεν αυτη ο ιησους εγω ειμι η αναστασις και η ζωη ο πιστευων εις εμε καν αποθανη ζησεται
. . . saying to her Jesus, I AM the resurrection and the life, the one believing into Me even dying shall live . . .
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Mon Jan 15, 2018 12:31 pm

mark s wrote:
shorttribber wrote:
mark s wrote:The classic teachings of Christianity over the centuries has been either post trib / post wrath, moving towards amillennialism. At least to my understanding.

That's true....I'm Post Trib Essentially (excepting only the last thirty days {That I believe is reserved for God's Wrath}). That's why I said in my statement, "Basically".


OK, so you are post trib / pre-wrath, which is not an historical viewpoint. The earliest references to pre-wrath that I am aware of were in the 1980's or so, am I remembering this right?

Much love,
Mark

Again, I was not saying that the rapture Timing was the exact same, only the Basic idea as to the End of the Tribulation.

Once more, my primary reference was to Daniel 9:27, and not the exact rapture timing.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Mon Jan 15, 2018 12:35 pm

mark s wrote:
shorttribber wrote:
mark s wrote:The classic teachings of Christianity over the centuries has been either post trib / post wrath, moving towards amillennialism. At least to my understanding.

That's true....I'm Post Trib Essentially (excepting only the last thirty days {That I believe is reserved for God's Wrath}). That's why I said in my statement, "Basically".


OK, so you are post trib / pre-wrath, which is not an historical viewpoint. The earliest references to pre-wrath that I am aware of were in the 1980's or so, am I remembering this right?

Much love,
Mark


The common "Prewrath view of Van Campen and Rossenthal, yes. And that's still in line with the 7 year trib idea.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby mrgravyard49 on Mon Jan 15, 2018 12:47 pm

Yes Mark, strongs. Just read on Fox that our government is telling people who travel to Korea to make a will. I am convinced something big will happen February 9th.
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Re: 2018..

Postby WOODHENOT3 on Mon Jan 15, 2018 12:49 pm

Mark,
Jesus is coming AFTER the tribulations of those days.. Matt 24.... I would have to say, He's a post trib also....LOL
In Christ Always,
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Re: 2018..

Postby mark s on Mon Jan 15, 2018 12:53 pm

shorttribber wrote:
WOODHENOT3 wrote:Shorttribber,

Do you believe the coming AC because of the Oct 21st SIGN?
Why would you give a window frame from Oct to April?


Because of the 70 Jubilees primarily. And the proximity in time to that sign....yes. But also other reasons on the world scene.


So . . . how do we know when the Jubilee year is?

And . . . why would we figure the Law to be determinate over the gentile Christian church?

Much love,
Mark
ειπεν αυτη ο ιησους εγω ειμι η αναστασις και η ζωη ο πιστευων εις εμε καν αποθανη ζησεται
. . . saying to her Jesus, I AM the resurrection and the life, the one believing into Me even dying shall live . . .
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:03 pm

mark s wrote:
shorttribber wrote:
WOODHENOT3 wrote:Shorttribber,

Do you believe the coming AC because of the Oct 21st SIGN?
Why would you give a window frame from Oct to April?


Because of the 70 Jubilees primarily. And the proximity in time to that sign....yes. But also other reasons on the world scene.


So . . . how do we know when the Jubilee year is?

And . . . why would we figure the Law to be determinate over the gentile Christian church?

Much love,
Mark


Because the Law was first established by grace, and grace fulfilled it.
Living under the Mosaic Law and Recognizing the days described in it are two different matters.
Israel is STILL Under the Law of Moses until they receive the grace and Liberty Christ came to Proclaim when he spoke the words he did in Luke 4 from Isaiah 61.

Is there a Jewish Church and a Gentile Church? No, there is not, we are One Household of God.

We live on the same earth, with the same amount of Time behind us, and before us. Time is Time, and it is impartial.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby mark s on Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:07 pm

Once again, this is an answer I don't really understand what it means. Or . . . maybe I do. Hmm. Perhaps having more to do with our more underlying differences of understanding.

One thing I'd like to clarify is that I believe that the Law given through Moses was not an act of Grace, it was the opposite, and that obedience was both required and offered to fulfill it.

It was the fulfilling of the Law through the obedience to it that is offered as a grace gift. For those of us that never were under the Law, it is offered as a life of righteousness, never falling short.

I also want to clarify the reason I mentioned gentile Christians is that the gentiles are not and never were governed by the Law given through Moses.

Maybe I think you're talking about that the Christians are removed at a certain sequence, and therefore the moment of time it happens is determined according to the sequence God ordained for Israel.

Much love!

Mark
ειπεν αυτη ο ιησους εγω ειμι η αναστασις και η ζωη ο πιστευων εις εμε καν αποθανη ζησεται
. . . saying to her Jesus, I AM the resurrection and the life, the one believing into Me even dying shall live . . .
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Re: 2018..

Postby mark s on Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:08 pm

Oh, and the Jubilee year?
ειπεν αυτη ο ιησους εγω ειμι η αναστασις και η ζωη ο πιστευων εις εμε καν αποθανη ζησεται
. . . saying to her Jesus, I AM the resurrection and the life, the one believing into Me even dying shall live . . .
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:16 pm

mark s wrote:Once again, this is an answer I don't really understand what it means. Or . . . maybe I do. Hmm. Perhaps having more to do with our more underlying differences of understanding.

Much love!

Mark

it's because you still see a distinct difference between a Jewish Part and a Gentile part of the Household of God.

I see Gentiles as Graft in to the Household of God. I do not view Jews and Gentiles as Separate from each other.

That's a whole knew thread....and we have many of those
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:23 pm

mark s wrote:One thing I'd like to clarify is that I believe that the Law given through Moses was not an act of Grace, it was the opposite, and that obedience was both required and offered to fulfill it.


See this part of your sentence? the Law given . It was a "Gift/Given"

The Law was a Gift, to Teach Right from Wrong. It was "Added" to the Abrahamic Because of Unbelief.
It was Given in the place of Destroying Israel on the Spot, when Moses interceded for Israel.

it was a "Gift of Mercy" from God...Rather than His Sudden and Swift Destruction upon them at Horeb.

I do not confuse Law and Grace.....but I do know that Everything God has Ever done is BY HIS GRACE, and that Does include the "GIVING" of the Law, to Moses.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby mark s on Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:00 pm

shorttribber wrote:
mark s wrote:Once again, this is an answer I don't really understand what it means. Or . . . maybe I do. Hmm. Perhaps having more to do with our more underlying differences of understanding.

Much love!

Mark

it's because you still see a distinct difference between a Jewish Part and a Gentile part of the Household of God.


What is the difference I see?

(Trick question)

Aren't we all lost without Christ?

Aren't we all one in Christ, when we come to Christ?

Won't we all live with God, all the redeemed from all the ages?

Much love,
Mark
ειπεν αυτη ο ιησους εγω ειμι η αναστασις και η ζωη ο πιστευων εις εμε καν αποθανη ζησεται
. . . saying to her Jesus, I AM the resurrection and the life, the one believing into Me even dying shall live . . .
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Re: 2018..

Postby shorttribber on Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:06 pm

I think the questions are going out kinda many different directions as to discussion.

Not much that relates largely to the main topic really....did I drift that far away from the topic? I guess I'm not really sure :mrgreen:
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: 2018..

Postby mark s on Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:08 pm

shorttribber wrote:
mark s wrote:One thing I'd like to clarify is that I believe that the Law given through Moses was not an act of Grace, it was the opposite, and that obedience was both required and offered to fulfill it.


See this part of your sentence? the Law given . It was a "Gift/Given"


HI ST,

I have this distinct feeling that you know what I intended my words to convey.

Even so, please allow me the opportunity to re-state myself for clarity's sake.

"The Law as stated by God, and written by both God and Moses, then imposed through Covenant between the children of Israel and YHWH at Mount Sinai"

Does that help?

Much love,
Mark
ειπεν αυτη ο ιησους εγω ειμι η αναστασις και η ζωη ο πιστευων εις εμε καν αποθανη ζησεται
. . . saying to her Jesus, I AM the resurrection and the life, the one believing into Me even dying shall live . . .
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Re: 2018..

Postby mark s on Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:09 pm

shorttribber wrote:I think the questions are going out kinda many different directions as to discussion.

Not much that relates largely to the main topic really....did I drift that far away from the topic? I guess I'm not really sure :mrgreen:


That's OK . . . you don't need to answer this one!

:grin:
ειπεν αυτη ο ιησους εγω ειμι η αναστασις και η ζωη ο πιστευων εις εμε καν αποθανη ζησεται
. . . saying to her Jesus, I AM the resurrection and the life, the one believing into Me even dying shall live . . .
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Re: 2018..

Postby mark s on Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:14 pm

shorttribber wrote:
The Law was a Gift, to Teach Right from Wrong. It was "Added" to the Abrahamic Because of Unbelief.


HI ST,

This seems unclear to me, and you've even put the word in quotes, Added. Added in the sense of modifying by addition the previous covenant? Or added in the sense of being a separate pertinent covenant?

It was Given in the place of Destroying Israel on the Spot, when Moses interceded for Israel.
it was a "Gift of Mercy" from God...Rather than His Sudden and Swift Destruction upon them at Horeb.


Can you point me to the Scripture passage on this one?

Much love,
Mark
ειπεν αυτη ο ιησους εγω ειμι η αναστασις και η ζωη ο πιστευων εις εμε καν αποθανη ζησεται
. . . saying to her Jesus, I AM the resurrection and the life, the one believing into Me even dying shall live . . .
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