Rev 6:8

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Rev 6:8

Postby Ready1 on Sat Jun 06, 2015 3:56 pm

(ASV) And I saw, and behold, a pale horse: and he that sat upon him, his name was Death; and Hades followed with him. And there was given unto them authority over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with famine, and with death, and by the wild beasts of the earth.

(BBE) And I saw a grey horse, and the name of him who was seated on it was Death; and Hell came after him. And there was given to them authority over the fourth part of the earth, to put to destruction by the sword, and by taking away their food, and by death, and by the beasts of the earth.

(ESV) And I looked, and behold, a pale horse! And its rider's name was Death, and Hades followed him. And they were given authority over a fourth of the earth, to kill with sword and with famine and with pestilence and by wild beasts of the earth.

(GNB) I looked, and there was a pale-colored horse. Its rider was named Death, and Hades followed close behind. They were given authority over one fourth of the earth, to kill by means of war, famine, disease, and wild animals.

(ISV) I looked, and there was a pale green horse! Its rider's name was Death, and Hades followed him. They were given authority over one-fourth of the earth to kill people using wars, famines, plagues, and the wild animals of the earth.

(KJV) And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

(LITV) And I saw, and behold, a pale green horse, and the name of the one sitting on it was Death; and Hades followed after him. And authority was given to them to kill over the fourth of the earth with sword, and with famine, and with death, and by the wild beasts of the earth.

(NLT) I looked up and saw a horse whose color was pale green. Its rider was named Death, and his companion was the Grave. These two were given authority over one-fourth of the earth, to kill with the sword and famine and disease and wild animals.

(RV) And I saw, and behold, a pale horse: and he that sat upon him, his name was Death; and Hades followed with him. And there was given unto them authority over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with famine, and with death, and by the wild beasts of the earth.

(YLT) and I saw, and lo, a pale horse, and he who is sitting upon him--his name is Death, and Hades doth follow with him, and there was given to them authority to kill, (over the fourth part of the land,) with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and by the beasts of the land.


In the past, I have looked at this passage and assumed that one fourth of the earth is killed by sword, famine, death, and by beasts. The current population of the earth is over six billion people, so by this understanding, over 1.5 billion people would loose their lives at this seal.

Yet as I reread it, I realize that it could mean that Death and Hell are given authority over only one part (1/4) of the earth and kill a portion of those that live in those parts. So while the total would still be horrific, it would not necessarily be 1/4 of humanity. I am curious how you understand this passage?

Is it possible that Death and Hell would be given authority over the Islamic 1/4 of the earth?
Just observing.

E.
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Re: Rev 6:8

Postby 4givenmuch on Sat Jun 06, 2015 8:40 pm

hmmmm.... you have me thinking.
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Re: Rev 6:8

Postby Exit40 on Sun Jun 07, 2015 7:06 am

Power was given 'them', being him whose name is death, and hades which comes with him, over one fourth of the 'earth'. So would this then be the portion of land mass, or where one fourth of the population lives ? I have to think this is another representation of the four beasts of Daniel 7, with this one being the fourth, and so having that approximate value of the four earthly authorities, and the power given them to rule, the fourth beast by conquest.

Dan 7:7
After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns.


Can it be said when islam takes over by conquest it devours and breaks the previous culture, and stamps the residue of it beneath it's feet ? I believe so, as currently being witnessed in Syria and Iraq today. Anything, and anyone who does not agree, convert to that brand of jihadist islam, is broken to pieces, or killed, the residue is given the worst treatment/insult a muslim can give, the bottom of feet stamping and mashing them underfoot, the residue of them being dust to be blown away in the wind as if it never existed, with no memory of it left behind. Islam accounts for not quite one fourth of the world's population currently, and is growing by leaps and bounds according to birth rates alone, while in the western world the birth rate can barely sustain the population, if it does at all. And so the immigration of many muslim peoples into the West, the need for them exists to maintain the State and civilization.

Rev 6:8
And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.


The sword is the symbol islam uses to present to unbelievers, meaning convert or die. Another way to say it is, convert and you will have peace and safety, within the confines of islam you will be accepted and live safely in relative peace as sharia law dictates. Hunger and famine speak for themselves, wild beasts of the earth are people, they kill without conscience as an animal does. Death is both first and second death, hades is a holding cell until the Judgement.

God Bless

David
Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God

T'was Grace that taught my heart to fear.
And Grace, my fears relieved.
How precious did that Grace appear
The hour I first believed.
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Re: Rev 6:8

Postby Ready1 on Sun Jun 07, 2015 9:19 am

Exit40 wrote:Can it be said when islam takes over by conquest it devours and breaks the previous culture, and stamps the residue of it beneath it's feet ?


I am still having problems seeing "Islam" as the fourth king in the same way you do. For the simple reason that Ismael, the father of the Arab tribes, where Islam has taken root, had a curse pronounced against him by God to Abraham in Genesis.

Gen 16:12 This son of yours will be a wild man, as untamed as a wild donkey! He will raise his fist against everyone, and everyone will be against him. Yes, he will live in open hostility against all his relatives."


As we look at the Arab world today, they are largely "tribal nations", and not one of them can get along with the rest of them. They kill each other over the fact that one man's brand of Islam is not quite like another's brand. They label each other "apostate", and in spite of the fact that while they have a common enemy, it is more important to kill each other. In fact, currently we have two "Worldwide Caliphates"! ISIS and Turkey. Every Imam wants to be the head of the Caliphate. And none of them ever back down or work together.

How can we have a ten nation Islamic/Arabic coalition when two nations can't even work together. How can there be a ten nation coalition when it is hard-coded into their genetics to raise their fist against everyone? So while I appreciate your symbolism and recognize some truth there, I don't necessarily see your conclusion as being valid.

:grin:
Just observing.

E.
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Re: Rev 6:8

Postby Exit40 on Mon Jun 08, 2015 5:50 am

Hi Ready1.

How can we have a ten nation Islamic/Arabic coalition when two nations can't even work together. How can there be a ten nation coalition when it is hard-coded into their genetics to raise their fist against everyone?


Because Scripture states they will.

Eze 38:21 And I will call for a sword against him throughout all my mountains, saith the Lord GOD: every man's sword shall be against his brother.

Many Scriptures speak to the nature of the beast, surely resembling islam more than anything else. The above states the conditions you speak of continuing right on through the invasion of Israel. What is not an absolute certainty is, how long the magog forces are in Israel before ...

Eze 38:18 And it shall come to pass at the same time when Gog shall come against the land of Israel, saith the Lord GOD, that my fury shall come up in my face.

And muslim nations must at some point join together to enough of a degree to accomplish what Scripture states they will. They are not in complete agreement, ever. Just as it is written, so it shall come to pass.

God Bless You

David
Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God

T'was Grace that taught my heart to fear.
And Grace, my fears relieved.
How precious did that Grace appear
The hour I first believed.
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Re: Rev 6:8

Postby Exit40 on Mon Jun 08, 2015 6:33 am

Ready1, there are certain understandings within the islamic paradigm which must be looked at. I am not sure if these have been written about elsewhere, I have to some degree. Regardless anyone's belief about gog/magog, whether it be Armageddon or not, in order to come about Syria must be involved, as this is the direction it comes from. Many years ago I suggested islam would attempt to reform, but it would be false, something I deduced from the Scriptures, and Syria would be the most important aspect of it in relation to Israel. The Arab Spring seems to be what I wrote about, sweeping though many muslim nations. Syria is now four years into their conflict, and what we have there is the focus of islam with the many sects and divisions of islam itself attempting to gain power and leadership. As the West has withdrawn the vacuum has allowed the rise of isis, which represents the wild beasts of the earth as I see it. I do not believe they will go way, the leadership and it's concept will, but they will be absorbed into the coming coalition that is forming up today. Turkey, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Egypt, are the primary leaders of this coalition, the rebel group they are supporting is called jaish al fatah. This group currently has coalesced from other rebel groups, seven so far, and is making gains in territory and support of local peoples. I believe eventually they will be successful in taking over Syria, Assad will be out, and the struggle there will continue until an ersatz caliphate will form. This will be ' no kingdom' until the caliphate becomes agreed upon by the majority of muslim scholars. Much will happen in our day to day world, perhaps for many years, but skipping to the end here is that kingdom ...

Isa 17:3
The fortress also shall cease from Ephraim, and the kingdom from Damascus, and the remnant of Syria: they shall be as the glory of the children of Israel, saith the LORD of hosts.


God Bless You

David
Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God

T'was Grace that taught my heart to fear.
And Grace, my fears relieved.
How precious did that Grace appear
The hour I first believed.
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Re: Rev 6:8

Postby Straightshot on Mon Jun 08, 2015 9:56 am

My comment


The seals are portents of the coming tribulation and not the actual events

Revelation 6:8 portends massive human death during the tribulation period, but there is no specific relationship to "Islam" given

However, the prophets do see the specific populations of the Middle East surrounding Israel at the time of the end .... all are the virulent enemies of Israel's presence .... and they are all primarily of the Islamic faith

This is no coincidence .... the age old controversy between Issac and Ishmael is still on going today and the Lord will use this offset thay He set caused to bring about the pressuring of Israel for turning to Him as the nation's Messiah and king

The current upheaval in the Middle East between the Muslim factions is the exact picture of the iron and clay kingdom of Daniel's visions, the 4th, which will produce the northern human little horn who will be able to conquer and confederate them into his kingdom of 10 other human Islamic rulers

The stage for all of this is setting up as we speak

Watch the Middle East .... it will be in the days of these kings that the Lord will come and settle the controversy

Satan's beast in the human little horn and his Islamic kingdom will be destroyed by the Lord at Armageddon [Psalms 83; Jeremiah 30; Ezekiel 38; 29; Daniel 7:7-25; 8:9-25; 11:36-45: 12:7; Micah 5:5-6; Zechariah 12; 13; 14; Matthew 24:15-16; Luke 21:20-36; Revelation 14:14-20; 16:1-16; 19:11-21]
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Re: Rev 6:8

Postby Sonbeam on Mon Jun 08, 2015 1:51 pm

Death has been riding that "pale horse" since Cain killed Abel IMO.

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Re: Rev 6:8

Postby shorttribber on Mon Jun 08, 2015 4:44 pm

Sonbeam wrote:Death has been riding that "pale horse" since Cain killed Abel IMO.

sonbeam


Yes, I believe that "Spirit" has "gone out" since then also.
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=68781

The "prophetic Implications" of how and When, IT or THEY, have effected the Times After Christ are the Primary question though I think.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: Rev 6:8

Postby Ready1 on Mon Jun 08, 2015 5:53 pm

Since I don't equate Gog/Magog with Armageddon there is quite a little we would see differently Exit40. I probably take things a little more literal than you, so I would not equate ISIS with the beasts of the field either.

Anyone else want to take a "poke" :boink: at the OP?
Just observing.

E.
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Re: Rev 6:8

Postby 1whowaits on Mon Jun 08, 2015 8:49 pm

'Them', who are given authority would appear to be a reference to all 4 horsemen, all 4 horsemen combined together destroy a fourth of the earth. The passage restates what had already been described and sums it up, the 1st and 2nd horsemen destroy by war and conquest, the 3rd by economic collapse and famine, the 4th by plague and animals (viruses, bacteria- biowarfare?). Similar statements are made about the first 4 trumpets, a third of the earth, trees, ships etc are destroyed.

Gog-Magog and armgeddon are clearly 2 separate events, Gog-Magog an event involving mostly muslim nations in an attack by a limited number of nations, a 'preview' of what is to come, while armageddon involves all nations and Satan's forces, it will be the battle of the ages on a much larger scale.
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Re: Rev 6:8

Postby Straightshot on Thu Jun 11, 2015 12:34 pm

My comment

The Lord addresses Satan [gog] in Ezekiel 38; 39 and it is the battle of Armageddon

Revelation's description is the same and totally parallel [Revelation 14:14-20; 16:1-16; 19:11-21]

Psalms 83 gives the same from the perspective of the core and adjacent populations of the Muslim Middle East .... Ezekiel's view concerns the outer Middle Eastern Muslims .... these will also be lead by Satan's beast in the human little Horn of Daniel's visions

There is no other war contained within the scope of visions of the Bible prophets for the time of the end of this present age

There will be another at the ending of the Lord's coming millennial kingdom 1000 years later .... this human rebellion will be the next cause by Satan [gog] when he is released from the abyss to deceive the nations [symbolically "magog"]
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