number of its name

[grumpy]

Rev 13 - 17 so that no one can buy or sell unless he has the mark, that is, the name of the beast or the number of its name.18 This calls for wisdom: let the one who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man, and his number is 666.

I can't help but think that elsewhere in the bible that we may be shown how to calculate the number of its name. Perhaps there is something in the book of Numbers that I haven't realized. Has anyone here seen where we may be taught how to calculate or obtain the number of a name from the bible? I don't think it's meant to be a speculative number, such as the 44th President or 18 characters in 3 names which divides to equal 3 x 6's.

And though I haven't yet looked further into the claim that the beast will be a system rather than an individual, I feel it may have merit and is something I'll be spending time looking into. As even in the above scripture the beast is referenced with its and the beast and not as him or he (for example). And in my past studies, I've felt the beast was a separate entity from the AC which possibly means the AC's name won't equate to 666. - Just some trailing thoughts.

Sorry if this has been discussed at length and I missed it.

[kyle]

Rev 13 - 17 so that no one can buy or sell unless he has the mark, that is, the name of the beast or the number of its name.18 This calls for wisdom: let the one who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man, and his number is 666.

I can't help but think that elsewhere in the bible that we may be shown how to calculate the number of its name. Perhaps there is something in the book of Numbers that I haven't realized. Has anyone here seen where we may be taught how to calculate or obtain the number of a name from the bible? I don't think it's meant to be a speculative number, such as the 44th President or 18 characters in 3 names which divides to equal 3 x 6's.

And though I haven't yet looked further into the claim that the beast will be a system rather than an individual, I feel it may have merit and is something I'll be spending time looking into. As even in the above scripture the beast is referenced with its and the beast and not as him or he (for example). And in my past studies, I've felt the beast was a separate entity from the AC which possibly means the AC's name won't equate to 666. - Just some trailing thoughts.

Sorry if this has been discussed at length and I missed it.

Nowhere in scripture are we taught exactly what it means to be his number so that's where there are so many crazy speculations. I suspect that once it happens, we'll know (and it could be the Solano Resolution 666 stuff, who knows?).

And the book of Numbers has nothing to do with it. It was originally named something else in Hebrew, but I forget what that was. It is only known as Numbers because of the censuses taken in the book, nothing else.

[grumpy]

Thanks for the response. I know the book of Numbers carried a different name, but I was thinking maybe something with the methods used in gaining the censuses would give us insight. Not in the total numbers of clans, peoples, etc... But perhaps in numbering individuals, seems I remember leaders of clans though I'm not sure they were numbered.

Even if the answer is not in the book of numbers, I still feel like it's possible that somewhere the bible shows us how to number a name. It just seems to me that one who has understanding would represent people who've studied and understand the bible. And I just feel the answers are in there, even though they're meant only to be understood at the appropriate times by the appropriate people. I don't mind being wrong, as I usually am. I know that there were methods in the jewish or maybe hebrew culture for numbering a name and possibly that is what is being referenced as many things in the bible speak loudly within the context of the culture when they were preached. But then, it's the people that must endure the beast (in the end times) that need to know how to determine the number of a name so maybe the method is different. Or as you say, maybe it will be loud and clear when it happens.

[jgilberAZ]

One of the definitions of the word used to "calculate" is to 'reckon.'

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/reckon

And, the 666 in that verse is actually symbols, not the actual numbers 666.

http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lex ... 5516&t=KJV

http://www.math.tamu.edu/~dallen/histor ... count.html

And, those symbols are readable by Arabic speakers ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtquNNEO7Fw

The first two symbols (reading right to left) in Arabic mean "in the name of Allah."
The third symbol is two crossed swords, which is a symbol of Islam.

For reference ... when John records the 144,000 he uses words hekaton (100) and tessarakonta (40) and tessares (4) and chilias (thousand), not symbols. He did not use the symbols as he did in Revelation 13. It would have been much easier for him to have used the symbols for 144,000 rather than writing it out longhand. But, he didn't. God led him to write out longhand the words for 144,000 but not for 666. For that, God led him to use the symbols, which can be read in Arabic. 666 in Greek symbols == "in the name of Allah" and "the symbol of Islam."

[savedbygrace]

Ahhhh, leaning a bit towards a middle-eastern end times paradigm, are we?

[mark s]

They are not symbols, they are Greek letters. Greek used letters for numbers. The first is not "two crossed swords", it the Greek letter "Chi".

Is anyone asserting that John mis-wrote?

[jgilberAZ]

You misunderstand, Mark.

John used Greek numbers (see the link above). But, those same numbers are also Arabic words.

No one is saying John miswrote anything.

SBG, I've been leaning that way for a long time.

[IamtheWalrus]

Solomon gave the Egyptian Pharaoh 666 shekels for his wife.
Nebu built the statue 600 years before Christ, which was 60 cubits high and 6 cubits wide.
Neron Kesar/his Hebrew name in Gematria added up to 666.

The obvious implication here is that 666 is the number of a man which is how John put it.
What is implied, IMO, that this number identifies the world system, rather than God's system.
Putting the world before God, removes the seal imprinted on the hearts and heads of men and women, that is sealed on us when we come to Christ.

[DALLAS]

Walid Shoebat says it has nothing to do with numerology or calculations. The number of the beast is the multitude of people that follow the beast ( the multitude that follows Islam & Allah)?





SORRY typing in the dark tonight

[IamtheWalrus]

Walid Shoebat says it has nothing to do with numerology or calculations. The number of the beast is the multitude of people that follow the beast ( the multitude that follows Islam & Allah)?
SORRY typing in the dark tonight

Good typing though!

I have begun reading his book God's War on Terror, and I am intrigued by its premise.
A multitude following him, now I am even more excited to get to that area!

[joymart]

Walid Shoebat in his book "Why I Left Jihad" goes through this thoroughly. It is very sobering and one of those "ah ha!" moments as it seems so obvious. I recommend it.
The discussion begins on page 317 with "What is the name of the Beast".

[IamtheWalrus]

I stumbled onto this site while searching "multitude" and "mark" and would like to share it with all of you:

http://www.ridingthebeast.com/articles/ ... ical-mark/

[kyle]

I stumbled onto this site while searching "multitude" and "mark" and would like to share it with all of you:

http://www.ridingthebeast.com/articles/ ... ical-mark/

Thank you.

I'm not so sure of their explanation of why David's census was a sin, since God Himself has ordered censuses in other parts of Scripture. I remember having a discussion on that once with a friend of mine who's a Bible teacher because that always bugged me and he seemed to believe that it was because it was a sign of David's pride and of his trusting in his armies and people rather than in God, which makes a bit more sense.

The comparison with the other signs mentioned in Scripture though is definitely intriguing and something worth looking into. That page also linked to this which is news to me - http://av1611.org/666/barcode.html

[IamtheWalrus]

Some say its the barcode, or that it is a predecessor to it, however, it is the technology around it that is striking.
Ever wonder why Gold is on the rise for investors.
Granted Gold has had its ups and downs, but it is now considered the most stable investment out there.
I trade stocks, however, I have no Gold in my portfolio.
The simple fact remains, that Solomon's purchase for his wife was 666 talents of Gold.
It is up to us to discern with wisdom, as John instructs us to obtain, that this number, or multitude or man, somehow is tied in with the mark of the beast and the number/multiude of his name.
What strikes me in the fact that caphar is also translated into "penknife".
That alone is ominous and directly portrays the method of microchip insertion.
Through the needle.

Be on your guard folks.
Buy the Audacity of Hope, by Barack Obama.
His ties with Islam is much deeper than we think.

[DALLAS]

Walid Shoebat in his book "Why I Left Jihad" goes through this thoroughly. It is very sobering and one of those "ah ha!" moments as it seems so obvious. I recommend it.
The discussion begins on page 317 with "What is the name of the Beast".

I read a lot of this book for free on line. It can give you a head ache trying to absorb all the information, but it is still very much an eye opener! I do recommend checking it out!

[jgilberAZ]

Do you have a link to the online book, Dallas?

[lambslave]

The passage tells the reader how to calculate the number of its name because the name of the beast is mankind. When Daniel told Nebuchadnezzar his dream and the meaning of it in Dan 2 he explained that a figure of mankind whose various features represented all the forthcoming chapters in mankinds existence until Christ came and destroyed him, setting up His eternal kingdom. In Daniel chaptere 3, when Nebuchadnezzar subsequently erected an idol to be worshipped celebrating this dream he commanded that it measure SIX cubits wide, SIXTY cubits high, and it was erected SIX HUNDRED years before Chriist's birth. LS

[Douggg]

Thanks for the response. I know the book of Numbers carried a different name, but I was thinking maybe something with the methods used in gaining the censuses would give us insight. Not in the total numbers of clans, peoples, etc... But perhaps in numbering individuals, seems I remember leaders of clans though I'm not sure they were numbered.

Even if the answer is not in the book of numbers, I still feel like it's possible that somewhere the bible shows us how to number a name. It just seems to me that one who has understanding would represent people who've studied and understand the bible. And I just feel the answers are in there, even though they're meant only to be understood at the appropriate times by the appropriate people. I don't mind being wrong, as I usually am. I know that there were methods in the jewish or maybe hebrew culture for numbering a name and possibly that is what is being referenced as many things in the bible speak loudly within the context of the culture when they were preached. But then, it's the people that must endure the beast (in the end times) that need to know how to determine the number of a name so maybe the method is different. Or as you say, maybe it will be loud and clear when it happens.

Maybe the name is in the bible. Here is a theorectical name that I just happened to think about three or four years back, when considering 666 as found in the two places in the bible. One place was the talents of Gold that Solomon received. The other, quiet interesting, is the number of Adonikam's children coming from Babylon.

From Ezra Chapter 2.
... , six hundred twenty and three. 12 The children of Azgad, a thousand two hundred twenty and two. 13 The children of Adonikam, six hundred sixty and six. 14 The children of Bigvai, two thousand fifty and six. 15 The children of Adin ...

When people take the "666" would that not make them Children of the Antichrist? And Adonikam's children numbered 666. And Adonikam, I have been told by a Jew who is an expert in the Hebrew language, means "my risen lord".....which is that not what the Antichrist is going to do?

Now get this, there is more...

From Nehemiah Chapter 7.
... , six hundred twenty and eight. 17 The children of Azgad, two thousand three hundred twenty and two. 18 The children of Adonikam, six hundred threescore and seven. 19 The children of Bigvai, two thousand threescore and seven. 20 The children of Adin ...

Why 667 instead of 666 children in that passage? It is because, as I understand it, Adonikam himself was included in the count. So as there will be the one "Antichrist", Adonikam himself , his followers his children will be little "antichrists", i.e. 666ers, the biblical number associated with his name in Ezra Chapter 2.

So given that possibility, I went to an on-line gematria calcuator... and started playing around with different name
combinations using Adonikam as the last name. Now keep in mind that the Jews are expecting two messiah's - one messiah ben Joseph and the other messiah ben David.... ben David is the greater of the two since he will be the King of Israel. So I type in David Adonikam into the calulator - and came up with the wrong answer. Then I tried a bunch of other combinations. Finally after messing around for 20 minutes or so, I tried Yosef (Jewish for Joseph) Adonikam. Here is the link to that calculator...[url]
http://www.cs.utk.edu/~mclennan/OM/BA/I ... l#gematria [/url] Scroll down on that page until you come to the Hebrew Gematria calculator... and type in "Yosef Adonikam" and see what you get. Remember Adonikam means "my risen lord", and what will the Antichrist claim?

So will Yosef Adonikam be the name of the Antichrist when he comes on the scene incognito or will that be an assumed name when he recovers from the deadly wound or neither? It is just something to keep in mind should some guy named Adonikam emerges in the near future.

Doug L.

[DALLAS]

Do you have a link to the online book, Dallas?

I haven't found the right link yet, it has been at least a year since I read it. You can google "Why I left Jihad" or watch some of his interviews on You Tube or watch him on Zola Levitt's web site.

Walid Shoebat claims that the Lord's message was meant for simple shepards and when the time is right we will be able to understand without resorting to complicated calculations.

I watched one of his videos tonight on You Tube re Obama and he said that when Louis Farrakhan from the Nation of Islam proclaims Obama as the messiah he is actualy referring to him as the awaited Mahdi.

[Salty Skipper]

I'm going to have to agree with Mr. Shoebat on this one. It's not going to be complicated. The Lord does not wish for us to be in the dark.

[good4u]

And, the 666 in that verse is actually symbols, not the actual numbers 666.

The first two symbols (reading right to left) in Arabic mean "in the name of Allah."
The third symbol is two crossed swords, which is a symbol of Islam.

Here is the meaning of the above, as someone who has studied Islamic Eschatolgy, ready?


IN THE NAME OF ALLAH JIHAD.

Could 666 be the battle cry of Al-Madi or in the case of Christians, the Antichrist?

I report; you decide.

I have already made my conclusions. It is your turn...