Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

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Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby Mark F on Sun Mar 03, 2019 5:34 am

What reasons does Scripture give as the purpose of the Great Tribulation?
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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby Jericho on Sun Mar 03, 2019 8:22 am

I think Daniel sums it up:

“Seventy weeks are determined
For your people and for your holy city,
To finish the transgression,
To make an end of sins,
To make reconciliation for iniquity,
To bring in everlasting righteousness,
To seal up vision and prophecy,
And to anoint the Most Holy. Dan 9:24


I don't have much time right now, but the Great Tribulation is meant as a transitional period to prepare for the return of Christ and setting up the Millennial Kingdom. I think it serves multiple purposes: To get the Jews into position where they will accept Jesus as the Messiah, to judge the gentile nations for their sins and rebellion, and to separate the wheat from the tares, those who are for God and those who are against Him.
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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby extravagantchristian on Sun Mar 03, 2019 9:49 am

I think Jesus wants to come back now, but if He did so many people aren't ready because they're still on the fence. They're still lost and haven't yet made the choice to confess Jesus and be saved.

I think the purpose for the GT is to cause people to make a decision. To decide once and for all whom they will serve.

In the last days, people will be forced to make a choice. Even if they are hated by all.

The Great Tribulation, even though painful is actually for the benefit of those who still need to be saved.

Daniel 12:10
Many shall be purified, made white, and refined, but the wicked shall do wickedly; and none of the wicked shall understand, but the wise shall understand.

It's going to be a time of great harvest....
Much like in the book of Acts, but on a larger scale. Worldwide.
Matthew 1:22
So all this was done that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the Lord through the prophets
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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby shorttribber on Sun Mar 03, 2019 11:33 am

extravagantchristian wrote:I think Jesus wants to come back now, but if He did so many people aren't ready because they're still on the fence. They're still lost and haven't yet made the choice to confess Jesus and be saved.

I think the purpose for the GT is to cause people to make a decision. To decide once and for all whom they will serve.

In the last days, people will be forced to make a choice. Even if they are hated by all.

The Great Tribulation, even though painful is actually for the benefit of those who still need to be saved.

Daniel 12:10
Many shall be purified, made white, and refined, but the wicked shall do wickedly; and none of the wicked shall understand, but the wise shall understand.

It's going to be a time of great harvest....
Much like in the book of Acts, but on a larger scale. Worldwide.



Yes EC, i agree in whole.

I will add a few more things too.

Just reading today what 1whowaits wrote regarding what Zechariah prophesied, I found an interesting nugget :grin:

Zech 2
8 For thus saith the LORD of hosts; After the glory hath he sent me unto the nations which spoiled you: for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye.

Did you catch that? After The Glory?......What is the End Cause? What is the Reason? What is God AFTER, regarding the Coming Time of Trouble?

This is one of the Reasons I think, one of the Main Reasons beside what you have already mentioned EC.....
Read this next scripture very slowly and pay close attention to certain words....

2 Thes. 1:
4 So that we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and tribulations that ye endure:


5 Which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer:

6 Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you;

7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.


:banana: His Power and Glory in the Saints WILL BE CONFIRMED....in that Day :banana:

And Abraham saw That City (that Glorious Place where God dwells), who's builder and maker is God....Not Man.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby Mark F on Tue Mar 05, 2019 4:48 am

Jericho wrote:I think Daniel sums it up:

“Seventy weeks are determined
For your people and for your holy city,
To finish the transgression,
To make an end of sins,
To make reconciliation for iniquity,
To bring in everlasting righteousness,
To seal up vision and prophecy,
And to anoint the Most Holy. Dan 9:24


I don't have much time right now, but the Great Tribulation is meant as a transitional period to prepare for the return of Christ and setting up the Millennial Kingdom. I think it serves multiple purposes: To get the Jews into position where they will accept Jesus as the Messiah, to judge the gentile nations for their sins and rebellion, and to separate the wheat from the tares, those who are for God and those who are against Him.

I agree Jericho, that passage is a sweeping overview of that time. I would say that it is a time of consummation to accomplish all you listed.
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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby Mark F on Tue Mar 05, 2019 4:59 am

extravagantchristian wrote:I think Jesus wants to come back now, but if He did so many people aren't ready because they're still on the fence. They're still lost and haven't yet made the choice to confess Jesus and be saved.

I think the purpose for the GT is to cause people to make a decision. To decide once and for all whom they will serve.

In the last days, people will be forced to make a choice. Even if they are hated by all.

The Great Tribulation, even though painful is actually for the benefit of those who still need to be saved.

Daniel 12:10
Many shall be purified, made white, and refined, but the wicked shall do wickedly; and none of the wicked shall understand, but the wise shall understand.

It's going to be a time of great harvest....
Much like in the book of Acts, but on a larger scale. Worldwide.

Revelation 9 and 16 say that although God pours out so many terrible things on the earth, men refused to repent. Personally I'm unsure if there is much harvest outside the Jews at the very conclusion, but Scripture says 2/3 will be killed prior to that. I also believe that there will be Gentiles saved but Revelation seems to say they will die for it.
Mark

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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby extravagantchristian on Tue Mar 05, 2019 6:20 am

Mark f, why are the 2 witnesses coming? Their ministry will not be in vain.

And not only them but, imagine how God could use us His Church, at a time when his word is finally coming to pass, and prophecy is actually being fulfilled worldwide, for the first time in history.

"Many believed in his name when they saw the signs that He did"

I think so many people are searching for truth and willing to take a stand. What would it be like to be able to tell people around us, "Look, his words are coming true, he told us beforehand and now it's happening."
Matthew 1:22
So all this was done that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the Lord through the prophets
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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby Ready1 on Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:56 pm

God has an outstanding "beef" with the nations of the earth who are evil and will settle with them during the Trib.

Jer 25:15 For thus saith the LORD God of Israel unto me; Take the wine cup of this fury at my hand, and cause all the nations, to whom I send thee, to drink it.
Jer 25:16 And they shall drink, and be moved, and be mad, because of the sword that I will send among them.
Jer 25:17 Then took I the cup at the LORD'S hand, and made all the nations to drink, unto whom the LORD had sent me:

25:30 Therefore prophesy thou against them all these words, and say unto them, The LORD shall roar from on high, and utter his voice from his holy habitation; he shall mightily roar upon his habitation; he shall give a shout, as they that tread the grapes, against all the inhabitants of the earth.
Jer 25:31 A noise shall come even to the ends of the earth; for the LORD hath a controversy with the nations, he will plead with all flesh; he will give them that are wicked to the sword, saith the LORD.
Jer 25:32 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, Behold, evil shall go forth from nation to nation, and a great whirlwind shall be raised up from the coasts of the earth.
Jer 25:33 And the slain of the LORD shall be at that day from one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth: they shall not be lamented, neither gathered, nor buried; they shall be dung upon the ground.
Jer 25:34 Howl, ye shepherds, and cry; and wallow yourselves in the ashes, ye principal of the flock: for the days of your slaughter and of your dispersions are accomplished; and ye shall fall like a pleasant vessel.
Jer 25:35 And the shepherds shall have no way to flee, nor the principal of the flock to escape.
Jer 25:36 A voice of the cry of the shepherds, and an howling of the principal of the flock, shall be heard: for the LORD hath spoiled their pasture.


You can read the rest of the chapter as well.
Just observing.

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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby Mark F on Wed Mar 06, 2019 4:18 am

Thanks Reday1, I will.
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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby Mark F on Wed Mar 06, 2019 4:27 am

extravagantchristian wrote:Mark f, why are the 2 witnesses coming? Their ministry will not be in vain.

And not only them but, imagine how God could use us His Church, at a time when his word is finally coming to pass, and prophecy is actually being fulfilled worldwide, for the first time in history.

"Many believed in his name when they saw the signs that He did"

I think so many people are searching for truth and willing to take a stand. What would it be like to be able to tell people around us, "Look, his words are coming true, he told us beforehand and now it's happening."

So you think the purpose of the Great Tribulation is primarily a last call to salvation?

I think the witnesses are sent to Israel.
Mark

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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby Mark F on Wed Mar 06, 2019 5:05 am

shorttribber wrote:
extravagantchristian wrote:I think Jesus wants to come back now, but if He did so many people aren't ready because they're still on the fence. They're still lost and haven't yet made the choice to confess Jesus and be saved.

I think the purpose for the GT is to cause people to make a decision. To decide once and for all whom they will serve.

In the last days, people will be forced to make a choice. Even if they are hated by all.

The Great Tribulation, even though painful is actually for the benefit of those who still need to be saved.

Daniel 12:10
Many shall be purified, made white, and refined, but the wicked shall do wickedly; and none of the wicked shall understand, but the wise shall understand.

It's going to be a time of great harvest....
Much like in the book of Acts, but on a larger scale. Worldwide.



Yes EC, i agree in whole.

I will add a few more things too.

Just reading today what 1whowaits wrote regarding what Zechariah prophesied, I found an interesting nugget :grin:

Zech 2
8 For thus saith the LORD of hosts; After the glory hath he sent me unto the nations which spoiled you: for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye.

Did you catch that? After The Glory?......What is the End Cause? What is the Reason? What is God AFTER, regarding the Coming Time of Trouble?

This is one of the Reasons I think, one of the Main Reasons beside what you have already mentioned EC.....
Read this next scripture very slowly and pay close attention to certain words....

2 Thes. 1:
4 So that we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and tribulations that ye endure:


5 Which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer:

6 Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you;

7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,

8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:

9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.


:banana: His Power and Glory in the Saints WILL BE CONFIRMED....in that Day :banana:

And Abraham saw That City (that Glorious Place where God dwells), who's builder and maker is God....Not Man.

I don't see the glory as the reason, I see it as part of a righteous act. God surrounds Jerusalem as the wall around her to protect her which is a demonstration of His splendor, (Zech 2:5) after that He goes to the nations to punish them. In that is the purpose. God protects because of evil. That evil isn't His purpose, but executing judgement upon those who practiced evil against the apple of His eye is the purpose.

The Passage in Acts uses glory as an evidence of their faith. Paul says we have a righteous pride in knowing your faith is true as is evidenced by the troubles and persecutions you have endured.

My thoughts on it. :)
Mark

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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby shorttribber on Wed Mar 06, 2019 1:27 pm

Mark F wrote: don't see the glory as the reason, I see it as part of a righteous act. God surrounds Jerusalem as the wall around her to protect her which is a demonstration of His splendor, (Zech 2:5) after that He goes to the nations to punish them. In that is the purpose. God protects because of evil. That evil isn't His purpose, but executing judgement upon those who practiced evil against the apple of His eye is the purpose.


Isn't what you've mentioned part of the passage I quoted above?

Here is part of the quote again....

Mark F wrote:2 Thes. 1:4 So that we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in all your persecutions and tribulations that ye endure:5 Which is a manifest token of the righteous judgment of God, that ye may be counted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which ye also suffer:6 Seeing it is a righteous thing with God to recompense tribulation to them that trouble you;


And the same passage agrees with EC when saying this...
extravagantchristian wrote:"Many believed in his name when they saw the signs that He did"I think so many people are searching for truth and willing to take a stand. What would it be like to be able to tell people around us, "Look, his words are coming true, he told us beforehand and now it's happening."


The following words agree perfectly.....
Mark F wrote:10 When he shall come to be glorified in his saints, and to be admired in all them that believe (because our testimony among you was believed) in that day.


And here next...in perfect agreement...
Rev 14
12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.
13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them.

That part above..."keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus." IS "our testimony among you"(2Thes 1:19 above) and " which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ."(Rev12:)

1Pet
6 Wherein ye greatly rejoice, though now for a season, if need be, ye are in heaviness through manifold temptations:
7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:
8 Whom having not seen, ye love; in whom, though now ye see him not, yet believing, ye rejoice with joy unspeakable and full of glory:
9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby Mark F on Thu Mar 07, 2019 4:21 am

ST,
So what are you saying the purpose of the GT is then?

EC seems to say to cause people to be saved, to push the fence sitters to a decision.

You added that "His Power and Glory in the Saints WILL BE CONFIRMED....in that Day"
Mark

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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby shorttribber on Thu Mar 07, 2019 5:48 am

Mark F wrote:ST,
So what are you saying the purpose of the GT is then?

EC seems to say to cause people to be saved, to push the fence sitters to a decision.

You added that "His Power and Glory in the Saints WILL BE CONFIRMED....in that Day"


I'm saying I'm in agreement with EC, and that there is more than one reason for the GT.....and only the Lord Himself knows the gravity of each reason or purpose.
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby Mark F on Thu Mar 07, 2019 5:41 pm

Ok, got ya.
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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby extravagantchristian on Thu Mar 07, 2019 5:46 pm

Why did God choose to bring plagues upon Egypt in the days of Moses? That His power would be known, His people would be saved and their enemies would be put to shame.
Matthew 1:22
So all this was done that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the Lord through the prophets
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Re: Scriptural Reasons for the Great Tribulation

Postby shorttribber on Thu Mar 07, 2019 6:19 pm

extravagantchristian wrote:Why did God choose to bring plagues upon Egypt in the days of Moses? That His power would be known, His people would be saved and their enemies would be put to shame.

:a3:
The Wisest men have changed their Counsels and Resolves upon second thoughts, much more upon experience, and approaching evils not at first discovered. Rev. Herbert Croft, 1675

Where no counsel is, the people fall: but in the multitude of counsellors there is safety.

Find seven years of tribulation plainly stated in the Bible.
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