Wallmart and Dearborn -America's Kosovo

Discussion and debate of Religions that contradict scripture

Wallmart and Dearborn -America's Kosovo

Postby sheri on Mon Mar 03, 2008 1:29 pm

:shock: :( :eek:



http://www.newsweek.com/id/117835?GT1=43001


As America changes, so does the store where America shops. In Dearborn this week, the world's largest retailer opens a store like no other among its 3,500 U.S. outlets. Walk through the front door of the 200,000-square-foot supercenter and instead of rows of checkout counters, you find a scene akin to a farmers market in Beirut. Twenty-two tables are stacked high with fresh produce like kusa and batenjan, squash and eggplant used in Middle Eastern dishes. Rimming the produce department are shelves filled with Arab favorites like mango juice from Egypt and vine leaves from Turkey used to make mehshi, or stuffed grape leaves. A walled-off section of the butcher case is devoted to Halal meats, slaughtered in accordance with Islamic law (when a Wal-Mart manager noticed the pork section was too prominent he ordered it moved, since Muslims don't eat pork). In the freezer case, you'll find frozen falafel. You can also pick up a CD from Lebanese pop singer Ragheb Alama or buy Muslim greeting cards.


BUT THEY WON"T SELL hajab (headscarves). How bout' burka's?

"To fit into this bastion of ethnic tradition, Wal-Mart started two years ago to meet with imams and moms, conducting focus groups at Middle Eastern restaurants. Wal-Mart learned the community wasn't as concerned about seeing Arabic-language signs as they were with dealing with Arabic-speaking staff. So Bartell hired about 35 Arabic speakers, including Suehaila Amen, a local middle-school teacher who is providing ethnic sensitivity training to the 650 employees."

He also learned not to bother stocking traditional Muslim clothing, like the headscarf, or hijab, Amen wears. "The community told us, 'I would not feel comfortable coming to Wal-Mart to buy my hijab'," says assistant store manager Jordan Berke. "We're not here to overstep our bounds."


Wal-Mart has now officially reached Dhimmi status!!

Sam Walton must be rolling around in his grave!
SO DO NOT FEAR, FOR I AM WITH YOU; DO NOT BE DISMAYED, FOR I AM YOUR GOD. I WILL STREGTHEN YOU AND HELP YOU; I WILL UPHOLD YOU WITH MY RIGHTIOUS RIGHT HAND.
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Postby El Gallo on Mon Mar 03, 2008 1:47 pm

Wait, aren't various cites suing employers who require employees to speak English? I have no problem with Walmart's business decsion, but it shows a double standard.
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Postby stevesherri on Mon Mar 03, 2008 5:47 pm

Poor old Sam, he reached Mach 2 spinning in his grave long ago.
He broke through his casket and tunneled through the earth's core.
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Postby Ready1 on Mon Mar 03, 2008 5:54 pm

Poor old Sam, he reached Mach 2 spinning in his grave long ago.
He broke through his casket and tunneled through the earth's core.
...and now is 'channeling for the stars...
Just observing.

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Postby Tevye on Mon Mar 03, 2008 5:55 pm

As Arwa Hamad strolls a new Wal-Mart, an eight-foot display of olive oil stops her in her tracks. "Oh, wow," she says, marveling at the sight of so many gallons of Lebanese extra virgin. "We could go through one of these in a week in my house." Around the corner, row upon row of gallon jars of olives—from Turkey, Greece, Egypt and Lebanon—soak in deep hues of purple, red and green. "Look at the size of these olives," says the stay-at-home mother of three and native of Yemen. Hamad, 34, has shopped at Wal-Mart before, but never one like this. She is overcome with nostalgia as she spots Nido powdered milk and Al Haloub Cow, canned meat she calls the "Arabic Spam." "My father loves this," she says. "People from war-torn countries, this is what you lived on when you couldn't go out of the house to shop."

This Wal-Mart, though, isn't in a war zone.
It's in Dearborn, Mich., home to nearly a half-million Arab-Americans,
the largest concentration of Arabs outside the Middle East.


As America changes, so does the store where America shops.


[url=http://www.newsweek.com/id/117835] Arab/Islamic-America’s Store? - Link
[/url]
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Postby sherrimae on Mon Mar 03, 2008 7:11 pm

Walmart will do anything to make more profits. This is another good reason for me to avoid them.
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Postby sheri on Mon Mar 03, 2008 9:48 pm

Ready1 wrote:
Poor old Sam, he reached Mach 2 spinning in his grave long ago.
He broke through his casket and tunneled through the earth's core.
...and now is 'channeling for the stars...


:rolllaughing: :clap2: :laugh:

I needed that!!

Sheri :a2:
SO DO NOT FEAR, FOR I AM WITH YOU; DO NOT BE DISMAYED, FOR I AM YOUR GOD. I WILL STREGTHEN YOU AND HELP YOU; I WILL UPHOLD YOU WITH MY RIGHTIOUS RIGHT HAND.
isaiah 41:8-10
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Postby Exit40 on Tue Mar 04, 2008 8:32 am

I don't understand the negative comments going on here. What is the purpose of them ? Is there something wrong with people of Arabic decent buying products that are ethnocentric ? When I was a young man I worked in a store that provided heavily for the Jewish community it was centered in. Something wrong with that too ? Cmon folks, this anti islam attitude is lopping over into a racial thing. Where is the luv ?

God Bless

David
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Postby Lazarus43 on Tue Mar 04, 2008 10:06 am

Exit40 wrote:I don't understand the negative comments going on here. What is the purpose of them ? Is there something wrong with people of Arabic decent buying products that are ethnocentric ? When I was a young man I worked in a store that provided heavily for the Jewish community it was centered in. Something wrong with that too ? Cmon folks, this anti islam attitude is lopping over into a racial thing. Where is the luv ?

God Bless

David


Well said.

I also know of a store in a that is aimed specifically at providing foods for the Jewish community to buy. Many of its patrons speak Yiddish.

All Arabs are not Islamic, either. Many Arab Christians had lived in the Middle East for centuries and have been forced off their lands by Jewish settlers and migrated to the United States or other countries. Just as some Jews have become Christians, some Muslims have converted to faith in Jesus Christ. A large store with which I am familiar has sections that feature Jewish kosher foods as well as Mexican, Italian or Greek favorites. There is nothing wrong with it.

I also like mango juice.

Blessings,
Lazarus43
“A lie can get halfway around the world before the truth can even get its boots on.” - Mark Twain
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Postby burien1 on Tue Mar 04, 2008 10:25 am

I don't see anything wrong with a store catering to the needs of the community it is in. If they made all Wal-Marts cater to strictly arab needs, then I would be upset.
All the stores in my area have now added mexican food isles. That makes good business sense. There are a few Chinese stores here and there that sell all Chinese products. I actually like to explore the foods and wares of other cultures, even the different medicines and common household items they use. It's very informative. :2cents:

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Postby Sword of Geddon on Tue Mar 04, 2008 12:14 pm

you guys are crazy. This is clearly one step towards the islamification of America.
"Trust in the Lord with all your heart, and lean not on your own understanding." Proverbs 3:5
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Postby sheri on Tue Mar 04, 2008 12:40 pm

Exit40 wrote:I don't understand the negative comments going on here. What is the purpose of them ? Is there something wrong with people of Arabic decent buying products that are ethnocentric ? When I was a young man I worked in a store that provided heavily for the Jewish community it was centered in. Something wrong with that too ? Cmon folks, this anti islam attitude is lopping over into a racial thing. Where is the luv ?

God Bless

David


O.K... This is not a racial issue because Islam is not a race but a political/social/economical/legal ideology thinly veiled under the name of "religion".

When a major , national chain kow tows to one segment of its population, that is very different than your neighborhood mom and pop store catering to a specific clientel. When a store sells "halal" products and shields the pork from the rest of the store-- those are not actions aimed at "Arabs" but Muslims. Quote: "A walled-off section of the butcher case is devoted to Halal meats, slaughtered in accordance with Islamic law ".

When a store hires a "specialist" to give "sensitivity" training to 650 employees in order not to offend the ultra sensitive Muslims and says ""We're not here to overstep our bounds." that is just opening the door to dhimmitude.

burien1 says:
All the stores in my area have now added mexican food isles. That makes good business sense.

Yes, that makes sense, but that is one aisle or a part of one at most, not a WHOLE store..Does your store offer Latino sensitivity training to it's employees??

Lazarus wrote:
I also know of a store in a that is aimed specifically at providing foods for the Jewish community to buy. Many of its patrons speak Yiddish.

All Arabs are not Islamic, either. Many Arab Christians had lived in the Middle East for centuries and have been forced off their lands by Jewish settlers and migrated to the United States or other countries. Just as some Jews have become Christians, some Muslims have converted to faith in Jesus Christ. A large store with which I am familiar has sections that feature Jewish kosher foods as well as Mexican, Italian or Greek favorites. There is nothing wrong with it.


This store is not catering to Arab Christians! You say "Many Arab Christians have been forced off their land by Jewish settlers". Really? So many of your posts never fail to take a stab at Jews while defending Muslim Palestinians.


Do you not understand the aims of Islam is to infiltrate all areas of society, politics, our legal system (sharia law) ect. until Islam becomes dominate and is able to take over the whole of the world?
You have 3 choices in Islam :
1. Convert .
2. Remain a Christian/ Jew but as a second class citizen , a dhimmi, a slave to Muslims.
3. Or death.

Is this what you want for the future of our Country?


Dearborn has the highest Muslim population in America outside of the Middle East.

Will it become our Kosovo, declaring itself separate from America, a state within a state?

This move by Wal-Mart is just one more chink in the armor of America's freedom and sovereignity!

Don't throw the race card out at me- this is not a racial issue, but one of our very survival as a Christian Nation!

Please read this article on "Sharia Creep":

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Read.aspx?GUID=C9A33CD4-88D4-4162-A1C1-6777D90821EC

Author and expert on radical Islam Robert Spencer has been sounding the alarm about “sharia creep” for years at his website DhimmiWatch. In an exclusive interview with FrontPageMag.com, Spencer reflected on whether or not his efforts to warn the public were paying off

"I think we may be getting through to a very small number of people, but Muslim Brotherhood front organizations in the U.S. are still making tremendous headway by portraying these Sharia-creep initiatives as simple matters of civil rights, and playing on fears among public officials, and the public at large, of being seen as racist and bigoted.

It is getting worse, because there is a concerted effort by the MSA's on various campuses and other groups to push Muslim accommodation issues aggressively, but this effort is relatively new. We didn't see it on this scale ten or even five years ago. I think it is a natural outgrowth of the post-9/11 anxiety on the part of government and media not to appear ‘Islamophobic.’ As long as that continues to be a matter for concern, there will be continued accommodation of Muslim practices and Islamic distinctiveness, which only aids and abets the Islamic supremacist agenda.

The idea would be to awaken as many people as possible to what is going on here -- who the groups are that are pursuing this agenda, and what the agenda really is, behind all the talk of ‘hate speech’ and accommodation of cultural practices in the name of multiculturalism and diversity.


And that agenda seems to be everywhere – from the big issues right down to British fish and chips. When it was revealed in late February that a popular British snack food contained traces of alcohol, a Muslim Council of Britain spokesman declared, “Certainly we would find it very offensive to have eaten food with alcohol.”
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I don't want to see the Islamization of America , and neither should you!

WAKE-UP!

This move by Wal-Mart is much more than just having an aisle with a few ethnic foods.!

It is a systematic infiltration of Islam into America with the aim to eventually install Sharia as the law of the land , with Islam reining supreme!



In 1998, CAIR's founder, Omar Ahmad stated:
"Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faith, but to become dominant. The Koran should be the highest authority in America, and Islam the only accepted religion on Earth."


This attitude of "multicultural accommodation" towards Muslims expressed here is disturbing!

I suggest you go to:
link remove by acib
and have your eyes opened!

Sheri :armor:
SO DO NOT FEAR, FOR I AM WITH YOU; DO NOT BE DISMAYED, FOR I AM YOUR GOD. I WILL STREGTHEN YOU AND HELP YOU; I WILL UPHOLD YOU WITH MY RIGHTIOUS RIGHT HAND.
isaiah 41:8-10
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Postby Finaldash on Tue Mar 04, 2008 1:07 pm

I agree with you Exit. There is even a local Fred Meyer store in Alaska where I live summer time that sell a bunch of Filipino food. Obviously to cater to the big filipino community in Juneau, Ak.
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Postby Sword of Geddon on Tue Mar 04, 2008 1:26 pm

Islam is different...far different. Nobody should cater to the likes of them.
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Postby sheri on Tue Mar 04, 2008 1:54 pm

Finaldash wrote:I agree with you Exit. There is even a local Fred Meyer store in Alaska where I live summer time that sell a bunch of Filipino food. Obviously to cater to the big filipino community in Juneau, Ak.


O.K... were not talking about the Chinese, the Vietnamese,and Latinos ETHNIC FOOD here!!

Did you read anything I wrote above??

This is SPIRITUAL BLINDNESS being displayed here...the kind of sleepwalking Satan induced blindness covering the whole world today when it comes to ISLAM !!

WAKE UP!
WAKE UP!
WAKE UP!

.....before its too late !

:cry: :twoheadbang: :shark: :grrr: :lalala: :clock:
:praying: :praying: :praying: :praying: :praying:
SO DO NOT FEAR, FOR I AM WITH YOU; DO NOT BE DISMAYED, FOR I AM YOUR GOD. I WILL STREGTHEN YOU AND HELP YOU; I WILL UPHOLD YOU WITH MY RIGHTIOUS RIGHT HAND.
isaiah 41:8-10
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Postby Lazarus43 on Wed Mar 05, 2008 4:33 am

Luke 6:27-37 (NASB)
Luk 6:27 "But I say to you who hear, love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,
Luk 6:28 bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you.
Luk 6:29 "Whoever hits you on the cheek, offer him the other also; and whoever takes away your coat, do not withhold your shirt from him either.
Luk 6:30 "Give to everyone who asks of you, and whoever takes away what is yours, do not demand it back.
Luk 6:31 "Treat others the same way you want them to treat you.
Luk 6:32 "If you love those who love you, what credit is {that} to you? For even sinners love those who love them.
Luk 6:33 "If you do good to those who do good to you, what credit is {that} to you? For even sinners do the same.
Luk 6:34 "If you lend to those from whom you expect to receive, what credit is {that} to you? Even sinners lend to sinners in order to receive back the same {amount.}
Luk 6:35 "But love your enemies, and do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return; and your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High; for He Himself is kind to ungrateful and evil {men.}
Luk 6:36 "Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.
Luk 6:37 "Do not judge, and you will not be judged; and do not condemn, and you will not be condemned; pardon, and you will be pardoned.


That is all well and good, but does it include learning a foreign language so we can talk to people who don't understand our language or selling people food they like to eat?

Perhaps herding them into a small area, building a wall around them to keep them away from everyone else and restricting their access to travel, water, food, medicine, fuel and electricity will make them loving friends. But we must begin by destroying many of their homes and confiscating their property and water rights. We could also call anyone who resisted the treatment they were given terrorists and then we could kill them and their families and neighbors to insure our security.
************************************************************
*Edited to add that those who have used the above plan reject Jesus Christ as a false prophet who needed to be killed to preserve the faith they hold dear.

"Who is the liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, the one who denies the Father and the Son. Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also." 1 John 2:22-23 (NASB)
************************************************************

I think that plan is being used in the world today, but I do not think it is God's plan. What Jesus taught is God's plan.

Blessings,
Lazarus43
Last edited by Lazarus43 on Wed Mar 05, 2008 7:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Swayde on Wed Mar 05, 2008 5:30 am

I agree with you Sheri, I see it the same way. It's not a race thing, it's a spiritual thing. It's the forces of satan taking on the forces of God in the real world.
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Postby not there yet on Wed Mar 05, 2008 8:34 am

As I read some of these posts I can't help but wonder...when did God stop being God? When did He become inept? When did he abdicate His power and plan to a nation or to a corporation?

What if the Islamification of America was a part of God's overall plan? Would we stand in His way to defend the lifestyle of a nation? There are times that I wonder if nationalism may be one of the greatest of apostasies because we elevate the love and needs of a nation above the sovereignty of our Father and His plan.
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Postby Sword of Geddon on Wed Mar 05, 2008 8:41 am

Lazarus43 wrote:Luke 6:27-37 (NASB)
Luk 6:27 "But I say to you who hear, love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,
Luk 6:28 bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you.
Luk 6:29 "Whoever hits you on the cheek, offer him the other also; and whoever takes away your coat, do not withhold your shirt from him either.
Luk 6:30 "Give to everyone who asks of you, and whoever takes away what is yours, do not demand it back.
Luk 6:31 "Treat others the same way you want them to treat you.
Luk 6:32 "If you love those who love you, what credit is {that} to you? For even sinners love those who love them.
Luk 6:33 "If you do good to those who do good to you, what credit is {that} to you? For even sinners do the same.
Luk 6:34 "If you lend to those from whom you expect to receive, what credit is {that} to you? Even sinners lend to sinners in order to receive back the same {amount.}
Luk 6:35 "But love your enemies, and do good, and lend, expecting nothing in return; and your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High; for He Himself is kind to ungrateful and evil {men.}
Luk 6:36 "Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.
Luk 6:37 "Do not judge, and you will not be judged; and do not condemn, and you will not be condemned; pardon, and you will be pardoned.


That is all well and good, but does it include learning a foreign language so we can talk to people who don't understand our language or selling people food they like to eat?

Perhaps herding them into a small area, building a wall around them to keep them away from everyone else and restricting their access to travel, water, food, medicine, fuel and electricity will make them loving friends. But we must begin by destroying many of their homes and confiscating their property and water rights. We could also call anyone who resisted the treatment they were given terrorists and then we could kill them and their families and neighbors to insure our security.
************************************************************
*Edited to add that those who have used the above plan reject Jesus Christ as a false prophet who needed to be killed to preserve the faith they hold dear.

"Who is the liar but the one who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, the one who denies the Father and the Son. Whoever denies the Son does not have the Father; the one who confesses the Son has the Father also." 1 John 2:22-23 (NASB)
************************************************************

I think that plan is being used in the world today, but I do not think it is God's plan. What Jesus taught is God's plan.

Blessings,
Lazarus43


Perhaps you want to be a slave to the islamists but I don't Lazarus. Quoting above scripture is all well and good, but some enemies don't deserve compassion. David killed the Hittites when they threatened Israels existences. When an enemy threantens your very existence different rules apply.
"Trust in the Lord with all your heart, and lean not on your own understanding." Proverbs 3:5
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Postby Lazarus43 on Wed Mar 05, 2008 9:32 am

Sword of Geddon wrote:...Perhaps you want to be a slave to the islamists but I don't Lazarus. Quoting above scripture is all well and good, but some enemies don't deserve compassion. David killed the Hittites when they threatened Israels existences. When an enemy threantens your very existence different rules apply.


Please point out in any of the posts which I have ever made on this board where I have said, as you put it, that I "want to be a slave to the islamists." I do not think I have ever said or implied it. It is only in your imagination.

I do not understand how Arabs buying food at a Walmart in Dearborn would threaten your very existence.

Blessings,
Lazarus43
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Postby Finaldash on Wed Mar 05, 2008 9:47 am

Don't get me wrong I believe that Islam is a satanic religion.

But what if I love their food? Which I do. I have this Moslem girl (which I witness and debate almost everyday) that work for us and she happens to be the best and hardest working employee. She brings these awesome deserts and her mom cooks lunch for my wife often.

Sure it would strike fear in my heart having those things as a sign that "they" are coming but in the end having those food stuff available is the bright side of it. LOL
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Postby Lazarus43 on Wed Mar 05, 2008 9:52 am

Finaldash wrote:Don't get me wrong I believe that Islam is a satanic religion.

But what if I love their food? Which I do. I have this Moslem girl (which I witness and debate almost everyday) that work for us and she happens to be the best and hardest working employee. She brings these awesome deserts and her mom cooks lunch for my wife often.

Sure it would strike fear in my heart having those things as a sign that "they" are coming but in the end having those food stuff available is the bright side of it. LOL

Well said.

Blessings,
Lazarus43
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Postby Exit40 on Wed Mar 05, 2008 10:07 am

My, my, my. Look at all this. First of all this.........

Dearborn has the highest Muslim population in America outside of the Middle East.


So exactly what is wrong with having a store there that caters to the muslims ? Their money is just a green as ours, and the profits go where, Saudi Arabia ? Last time I looked this was still America, which by the way includes many Chinatowns, Little Italys, etc, etc. This is capitalism at it's finest, finding a market and going for it. From the secular standpoint I must say this attitude of negativity is most definitely discriminatory. Do you like to worship your God ? Then you must let others do the same. I would venture that most of the Dearborn muslims are Americans too. Whadya think of that ? Is there such a thing as a US reverse dhimmi ?

Why the horrendous FEAR display over one store in one neighborhood ? Sure there are plans to islamicize the US, but one store is not a national movement of note. It is not likely US law will allow Dearborn to secede, or make law contrary to our US Contitution, or maybe even the State Constitution. And I agree sensitivity training is a bit over the top, so maybe they should just call it 'respect training'. Or how about 'do unto others as you would have them do unto you' training. If employees are being forced to worship as muslims then I think we can agree this is wrong. But this is a store, not a mosque. As long as it operates that way, what's the beef ? Time will tell, doncha think ?

Freinds, this thing must be allowed to run it's course. Anger and fear produce only fuel for the so called enemy. Love and Grace produce the effects of our Lord. It is truly in His Hands to complete, Let's try do our share also.

God Bless You

David
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Postby Lazarus43 on Wed Mar 05, 2008 10:16 am

Exit40/David,

What are you trying to do, be a voice of calm and reason?

Refreshing.

Blessings,
Lazarus43
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Postby Exit40 on Wed Mar 05, 2008 10:36 am

Lazarus43 wrote:Exit40/David,

What are you trying to do, be a voice of calm and reason?

Refreshing.

Blessings,
Lazarus43


Hopefully, just one of many. Thanks for your contribution as well, and the others. I just don't think we should be discriminating against other Americans, and I don't think the Lord would care for it much either. Time will tell what this is going to be, so how about we just watch and wait patiently for it to develop. The sky is not falling, it's just getting a little gloomy. Surely we can handle that, can't we ?

God Bless You

David
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Postby burien1 on Wed Mar 05, 2008 10:50 am

I haven't read anywhere in my Bible that God gave us the USA as our Ark of protection against the world or those that would persecute us. I despise any religion that is anti-Christ,but as for the people, there but for god's Grace go I.

I think this country quit being a Christian nation a long time ago and that is why Islam and other religion's are being allowed to spread. Look at how many people like Obama call themselves "devout Christians." Real, true Christians are likely already a small minority.
Jesus himself said if we followed him, we would be persecuted, not that he would give us a safe haven in the USA.

I'm supposed to let the Lord's light show through me to unbelievers in order to show them the love the Lord has for them. I'm not supposed to show them fear and hatred. I don't want to be anyone's slave or have my head chopped off, but if that is a trial the Lord allows in my life, I pray he will sustain me through it.

I've been called crazy before :wink: When I gave my life to Jesus.

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Postby bok on Wed Mar 05, 2008 11:44 am

Sword of Geddon wrote:you guys are crazy. This is clearly one step towards the islamification of America.


Why is it the Islamification? Why not Arabification? Culture and religion are separable. There are many Arab Jew and many Arab Christians.
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Postby LandscapeMan on Wed Mar 05, 2008 12:01 pm

Prostitution come in many forms.

This just one example of how/ why I believe that the U.S. is the great whore of revelation.
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Postby sheri on Wed Mar 05, 2008 12:34 pm

bok wrote:
Sword of Geddon wrote:you guys are crazy. This is clearly one step towards the islamification of America.


Why is it the Islamification? Why not Arabification? Culture and religion are separable. There are many Arab Jew and many Arab Christians.


This ia an example of what we have to look forward to :

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml;jsessionid=3J5TR4RRMMZHTQFIQMFCFF4AVCBQYIV0?xml=/news/2008/01/13/nalien113.xml

I feel like an alien in my home town'

Yesterday, outside number 95A, his grandmother's former home, Mr Carbin gazed in bewilderment as he scanned his old haunt.

Not surprisingly, the stores of his youth had gone: such has been the change in our shopping habits over the decades that they have given way to supermarkets and fast-food outlet.

But that was not all that had changed irrevocably in Oak Lane. Among the new stores, the clothes shops sell Muslim dress, the butcher stocks halal meat and even the local takeaway advertises halal pizza.



"I feel like an alien, like I'm on a street in Karachi," Mr Carbin says, awkwardly.

"I don't feel I have anything in common with this area. It's like I've never been here before. I knew it would be different but I knew, too, that I would feel uncomfortably like I don't belong."

Mr Carbin is far from a racist, however. Well educated and widely travelled in Muslim countries, he has the utmost respect for the Islamic religion. What is worrying him is that Britain's increasing espousal of multiculturalism has led not to an integrated society but, instead, to ghettoisation, with white-only and Asian-only communities existing cheek by jowl but with little or no common ground. And that, he believes, could have an ominous outcome.


"This isn't, as the Government would like us to believe, a multicultural society," he says.

"This is pure racial segregation. And it's like this because the Muslim community simply refuses to integrate. So people like me feel like outcasts in our own country."


As Mr Corbin trudges farther along Oak Lane, he passes the tumble-down Anglican church where many of his former neighbours worshipped. Amid the mound of bricks, Sunday school hymn books are strewn.

Across town, in another Asian enclave, one local shopkeeper is preparing to sell up after 30 years running a family firm.

"I am retiring," he says. "But yes, it's true, a lot of people feel uncomfortable in Muslim areas. It's fine for me, I've stayed and I know everyone, but many are fearful of venturing into the area.

"It's not so much fear of violence, rather that they feel a sense of not being welcome, of having nothing in common with the community here, and a feeling that no one would appreciate the interest should they show it.

"I wish the Muslim community had integrated more, but they didn't. I haven't even been able to get them to join Neighbourhood Watch."

In the surrounding streets, the few white residents willing to talk speak of isolation rather than intimidation. One said he had had several members of the Asian community knocking on his door, asking if he wanted to sell his home.

"At face value, that seems innocuous," he says. "But others believe it was a message saying I should get out."

Another tells of how his father, an electrician, parked his van in the area only to have it rocked and thumped by a group of Asian youths telling him: "This is our area now. You are not welcome here.


It surprises no one, he says, knowingly, that a recently built massive police station, complete with a 30ft wall and a communications tower, now dominates upper Oak Lane.

In the nearby town of Dewsbury, which was once, like Bradford, a thriving mill area, similar enclaves exist. Local people were outraged recently to read that busy nurses at their local hospital had to allocate time to turning the beds of Muslim patients towards Mecca five times a day so that they could pray.


But, as Dr Patrick Sookhdeo, of the Institute for the Study of Islam and Christianity, points out, the notion of space and territory is vital to Muslims.

During the 1979 European Islamic Conference, a policy of integrating as communities, not as individuals, was advocated.

"Once those communities become the majority," he says, "they can control education, the economy and so on. And that is what has happened
SO DO NOT FEAR, FOR I AM WITH YOU; DO NOT BE DISMAYED, FOR I AM YOUR GOD. I WILL STREGTHEN YOU AND HELP YOU; I WILL UPHOLD YOU WITH MY RIGHTIOUS RIGHT HAND.
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Postby Finaldash on Wed Mar 05, 2008 1:11 pm

Just as long as they here legally, I really don't see a problem.
If you want to talk bout taking over a place, I'm sure you've been to Santa Ana, that place has got to be 80% Mexican. What do you think about what's happened there?
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Postby burien1 on Wed Mar 05, 2008 1:42 pm

Keep this in mind, folks,
Remember the 9-11 pilot Mohammed Atta? He absolutely hated the fact that Americanized restaurants and stores were in his country. He believed that they would destroy their islamic culture.

In the area we're discussing, all the local stores probably already cater to only the Muslim culture.
At least in a Wal-Mart , there are lots and lots of places to leave Christian Bible tracts. :wink:

YSIC
Psalm 119:105; Thy word is a lamp unto my feet, and a light unto my path.
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Postby Sword of Geddon on Wed Mar 05, 2008 3:04 pm

Are any of you actually reading Sheri's posts? The Islamic invasion is nothing like anything Chinese or anything else. Period.
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Postby sheri on Wed Mar 05, 2008 4:13 pm

Sword of Geddon wrote:Are any of you actually reading Sheri's posts? The Islamic invasion is nothing like anything Chinese or anything else. Period.


Exactly!! I don't think any of you are understanding that Islam is not the same as an ethnic group, and it is unlike any other religion in the world.
I don't say this without alot of research and reading. I have reached out to Muslim's and I have a heart for them as individuals who have been born into a religion where there is no escape except with great difficulty --which often leads them to be ostracized from their family or worse being killed ( ever heard of honor killings ? They are happening in this country now with more and more frequency).

Have you read my posts? have you gone onto the *link to religion of peace removed by acib* web site? Or do you just want to bury your head in the sand and remain anesthetized to what is happening in the world , especially the Christian and Jewish persecution taking place ANYWHERE Islam is allowed to become dominant???
I believe ministering to Muslims is my mission ,and we are to love them above all , BUT I cannot remain silent or complacent to the evil that is ISLAM ITSELF- it is truly SATAN'S RELIGION, IT IS THE VEHICLE THAT HE IS USING TO DESTROY ALL THAT IS GOOD IN THE WORLD AND REPLACE IT WITH EVIL!!

And i love my country too much to see this evil take it over!

AND YOU SHOULD TOO!!!

IF YOU WON'T TAKE THE TIME TO READ MY POSTS THEN MAYBE YOU WILL WATCH THESE VIDEOS:

Islam: What The West Needs To Know: Intro

Link

And then watch the actual movie on youtube in 12 parts:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s7m3r4Wla3s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDVaGFTTAug&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r_6u53Th6tw&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6maqkE4ju0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSnq6NnMfO8&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2jyvn7GE1w&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yHzw0FiQNtY&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmhEMwauA9A&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sozS05z7dkw&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JJK5KdV2w24&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4pX4y-bd-do&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gN5rwwSvLDU&feature=related

PLEASE TAKE THE TIME TO GET EDUCATED ABOUT THE TRUE NATURE OF ISLAM SO YOU WILL NOT BE FOOLED BY THIS FASCIST "religion".
Last edited by sheri on Sat Mar 08, 2008 11:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
SO DO NOT FEAR, FOR I AM WITH YOU; DO NOT BE DISMAYED, FOR I AM YOUR GOD. I WILL STREGTHEN YOU AND HELP YOU; I WILL UPHOLD YOU WITH MY RIGHTIOUS RIGHT HAND.
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Postby jesusistheway on Thu Mar 06, 2008 4:03 am

I wonder if anyone realizes that Sam Walton made his money loaning farmers money for expansion then repoed them after they could not pay. He is probably rubbing his grubby little hands in the grave.
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Postby Lazarus43 on Thu Mar 06, 2008 8:29 am

burien1 wrote:Keep this in mind, folks,
Remember the 9-11 pilot Mohammed Atta? He absolutely hated the fact that Americanized restaurants and stores were in his country. He believed that they would destroy their islamic culture.

In the area we're discussing, all the local stores probably already cater to only the Muslim culture.
At least in a Wal-Mart , there are lots and lots of places to leave Christian Bible tracts. :wink:

YSIC


What... more common sense... actually implying that shopping at Walmart for food they like is a step integrating Arabs into American culture and out of Islamic control over every part of their lives. Arabs and Americans of other ethnic groups who like the "farmer's market" type of atmosphere might even talk to each other and become less likely to kill each other.

Of course that goes against the belief that the first step of Christian evangelism is to incite fear and hatred against the people who are not believing what you believe. I don't think that can be found in the Bible.
*************************************************************
Before more posts are wasted claiming I don't understand Islam, please go to my favorite web site for information about Islam, Prophet of Doom - Islam's Terrorist Dogma in Muhammad's Own Words, where you can really learn about the demonic excuse for a religion called Islam.

A short excerpt quoted from the site:
Islam is a caustic blend of paganism and twisted Bible stories. Muhammad, its lone prophet, conceived his religion to satiate his lust for power, sex, and money. He was a terrorist. And if you think these conclusions are shocking, wait until you see the evidence...


While I may not agree with a few of the author's opinions posted on the site, I do believe its sections covering the background and history of Islam are among the best I have seen. The author has interviewed Islamic terrorists and spent thousands of hours researching Islam's historical documents. The website is extensive.

Death threats, attempts to shut down the web site and other efforts to silence the author are confirmation that he is striking a nerve with his words. There is a section with feedback from former Muslims and also there is feedback from Muslims who want him killed slowly.
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Postby not there yet on Thu Mar 06, 2008 8:36 am

What if the islamification of the US (no matter how vile it seems to us) is a part of God's ultimate plan? Where is our faith? Is it in our nation and its freedoms or in our Heavenly Father and His sovereign plan?
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Postby Lazarus43 on Thu Mar 06, 2008 8:52 am

not there yet wrote:What if the islamification of the US (no matter how vile it seems to us) is a part of God's ultimate plan? Where is our faith? Is it in our nation and its freedoms or in our Heavenly Father and His sovereign plan?

Then part of God's plan will include faithful Christians opposing Islam. Selling non-Christians food is not islamification.

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Postby Operator on Thu Mar 06, 2008 8:59 am

NotThereYet...

If you go with that kind of thinking...you might as well just sit back and do nothing about anything -because - what if that's what God wants?

I don't know - I may not be looking at this from a Christian standpoint - but I agree with Sherie! Is there a Wal-Mart that will cater to just the Christians - selling only Christian books, dvd's, etc? You could argue that there isn't a town/city made up of solely Christian people - but who knows? What if there is? Maybe I'm just being ridiculous and over-dramatic about it?
Forget the former things; do not dwell on the past. See, I am doing a new thing! Now it springs up; do you not perceive it? I am making a way in the desert and streams in the wasteland. Isaiah 43:18-19
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Postby Lazarus43 on Thu Mar 06, 2008 9:21 am

Over the past two years, Wal-Mart has tested its "store of the community": it has stocked stores in Chicago and Atlanta with products aimed at African-Americans and set up a hitching post at an Ohio store near a large Amish community. The Dearborn store, though, is the most extreme example of the concept. Wal-Mart offers its standard fare, plus 550 items targeted at Middle Eastern shoppers. "In the past, Wal-Mart has been pretty cookie-cutter when it comes to merchandise," says Dearborn store manager Bill Bartell. "But this time, we really got to know the community.


Again, it is not Islamification. "Wal-Mart offers its standard fare, plus 550 items targeted at Middle Eastern shoppers." There would still be thousands of "standard fare" items available to those outside the targeted Middle Eastern shoppers.
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Postby Exit40 on Thu Mar 06, 2008 9:58 am

Sheri, I most certainly agree with you that islam is the religion of satan. However, a walmart in Dearborn isn't the first nor the last step of islamification. The population already exists, therefore the need for a walmart, or any other type of outlet or service to exist there. Somehow walmart has become the focal point of what really appears to be islamophobia. This is a real phobia, it causes reactions that are not Christian like. OK, dance around the issue, but in reality this is the Lord's battle. He is the only one who can destroy satan's religion. We are told through prophecy we are going to be persecuted for His Namesake. It appears islam is the method by which it will come about. What is our part ? To represent the Lord as He is, the One who desires no one perish. The Lords Will Be Done.

This doesn't mean not to resist, but to do so with the Faith and Patience of the Saints. There is the strength that is not ours, but the Lord doing the battle through us. So how is it beneficial to anyone to complain about walmart serving a community ? That is not where the battle lies, it's within the community itself. Other folks can shop there too and no doubt find products they want and need. Lighten up a bit. There are communities like gay towns, gang towns etc, that are much more a danger to our country and lifestyle than Dearborns muslims shopping at walmart. Islam is just a part of the big picture, which IMO is appeasement multi-culturalism, PC thought and behavior, at least everywhere but for Christians and Jews. Scripture is full of accounts about the people of the latter days. It appears to be now, or in the near future. If those days are upon us how are we to act, be ? Scripture tells us this also. I don't mean to preach to the choir here, but really, we are not of a spirit of fear, but of power, that of the Lord. We should act accordingly.

God Bless You

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Postby bok on Thu Mar 06, 2008 10:33 am

Having a heart for witnessing means throwing xenophobia out the door. If it's not possible to separate ISLAM from ARAB, and if your view of Islam is that it's unchangeable, then your witnessing will never materialize.

"... and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it."

Victory for His church will be won by slaying people with the Word, not by criticizing their way of living.

Acts 11

1The apostles and the brothers throughout Judea heard that the Gentiles also had received the word of God. 2So when Peter went up to Jerusalem, the circumcised believers criticized him 3and said, "You went into the house of uncircumcised men and ate with them."

4Peter began and explained everything to them precisely as it had happened: 5"I was in the city of Joppa praying, and in a trance I saw a vision. I saw something like a large sheet being let down from heaven by its four corners, and it came down to where I was. 6I looked into it and saw four-footed animals of the earth, wild beasts, reptiles, and birds of the air. 7Then I heard a voice telling me, 'Get up, Peter. Kill and eat.'

8"I replied, 'Surely not, Lord! Nothing impure or unclean has ever entered my mouth.'

9"The voice spoke from heaven a second time, 'Do not call anything impure that God has made clean.' 10This happened three times, and then it was all pulled up to heaven again.

11"Right then three men who had been sent to me from Caesarea stopped at the house where I was staying. 12The Spirit told me to have no hesitation about going with them. These six brothers also went with me, and we entered the man's house. 13He told us how he had seen an angel appear in his house and say, 'Send to Joppa for Simon who is called Peter. 14He will bring you a message through which you and all your household will be saved.'

15"As I began to speak, the Holy Spirit came on them as he had come on us at the beginning. 16Then I remembered what the Lord had said: 'John baptized with[a]water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.' 17So if God gave them the same gift as he gave us, who believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I to think that I could oppose God?"

18When they heard this, they had no further objections and praised God, saying, "So then, God has granted even the Gentiles repentance unto life."
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Postby Finaldash on Thu Mar 06, 2008 10:39 am

Operator wrote:NotThereYet...
Is there a Wal-Mart that will cater to just the Christians - selling only Christian books, dvd's, etc? You could argue that there isn't a town/city made up of solely Christian people - but who knows? What if there is?
That's because they probably won't make money from it. Unfortunately the majority of Christians in America think they are fine without an active participation with real spirituality. If the Christians in America only had their Muslims (baseless) zeal then we'd probably find more christian items in those stores.
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Postby not there yet on Thu Mar 06, 2008 11:16 am

I may be wrong, but if my history and current events are correct, the greatest advances of the gospel have come in times and locations where persecution was the greatest. To be frank, I'm far more concerned about what Rick Warren and other emerging church advocates are doing to the Gospel than protecting national freedoms from Islam. In our free "Christian" nation we now have one of the greatest of apostasies and it isn't coming from those in Michigan. It is coming from the PDL junkies.

For me...it is about the Gospel of Jesus Christ. Everything else is a smokescreen. We aren't going to get special seats around the throne because we were Americans, Canadians, Brits, Republicans or Democrats.

Sorry if I sound like I'm ranting. I just don't get this thread.
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Postby sheri on Thu Mar 06, 2008 11:40 am

not there yet wrote:What if the islamification of the US (no matter how vile it seems to us) is a part of God's ultimate plan? Where is our faith? Is it in our nation and its freedoms or in our Heavenly Father and His sovereign plan?


No, it is not part of God's plan , but Satan's for the world to fall under Islam's veil. God can only do good, and Islam is not for the good of His people.


Romans 8:28

And we know that in all things God works for the good of those who love him, who have been called according to his purpose.


And we are not God's puppets, we have a choice- to let evil reign and overcome the Saints , or to fight against it. Do I think that putting Islamic food and goods into a Wal-Mart is the end of the world ? No, but it is one more step down the slippery slope of appeasement that will lead to our destruction, and it is a warning to us as Christians of what is to come. I don't believe God wants us to be passive and sit back when we see evil and say " OH well, it must be God's will" as life around us crumbles.

And again, please listen to the 12 part video I listed in the post above, to understand what exactly it is we are up against.

I believe Islam is the greatest threat that we will ever have to face.
SO DO NOT FEAR, FOR I AM WITH YOU; DO NOT BE DISMAYED, FOR I AM YOUR GOD. I WILL STREGTHEN YOU AND HELP YOU; I WILL UPHOLD YOU WITH MY RIGHTIOUS RIGHT HAND.
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Postby not there yet on Thu Mar 06, 2008 4:48 pm

Sheri,

Then how do we look at God's people who were exiled? Many died in exile away from their homes and native land. They lost their possessions and their freedom as they knew it. Was God not working for good when allowed them to be overtaken and exiled because of their sin?

Man decides what is fair based upon our human perspective. God decides what is just based upon His sovereign will and righteousness. I would respectfully disagree that Romans 8 supports "good" as men would define it.
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Postby sheri on Thu Mar 06, 2008 8:15 pm

Great new web site about "creeping sharia" in the West:

http://islamist-watch.org/


Middle East Forum Launches Islamist Watch Website
By Press Release: John Matthies (03/06/08)

PHILADELPHIA - Islamist-Watch, the website of the Middle East Forum's Islamist Watch project, is open for business.

Islamist Watch asserts that nonviolent radical Islam is more likely to alter the makeup of Western society over time than is terrorism. For while it is relatively easy to mobilize public opinion against terrorist groups, no institutions exist to counter the demands of non-violent extremists. Lawful Islamists lobby for legislation, influence curriculum and media content, advancing their agenda patiently, through non-violent means, bringing about fundamental changes in society. They also use "lawfare" (aggressive legal maneuvers) to close down academic, media, and political critics.

As a consequence, writes Daniel Pipes: "Quietly, lawfully, peacefully, Islamists do their work throughout the West to impose aspects of Islamic law, win special privileges for themselves, shut down criticism of Islam, create Muslim-only zones, and deprive women and non-Muslims of their full civil rights."


Recent examples of lawful Islamism include:

* Leading Muslim students in prayer at a public San Diego elementary school.
* Allowing cab drivers in Vancouver, B.C. to refuse certified guide dogs for reasons of religious conviction.
* Admonishing doctors and nurses in Scotland to refrain from eating in front of their Muslim patients and colleagues during the month of Ramadan.
* Proposing in the Netherlands that people of all faiths refer to God as Allah in order to "create more dialogue."
* The Archbishop of Canterbury's arguing that adopting elements of Shari'a law in Britain would benefit social cohesion.
* Allowing members of polygamous marriages to claim extra welfare benefits in Britain.
* Sponsoring a Muslim lifeguard program for the benefit of private female sessions at the city pool in Mississauga, Canada.
* Dropping Knorbert the piglet as mascot of Fortis Bank for fear of offending Muslims.


The website makes an original contribution to the study of lawful Islamism, and expands the project's reach by:

* Publishing original and commissioned work on the Islamist push in the West;
* Cataloguing, under "Creeping Dhimmitude," examples of the West's misguided efforts to accommodate radical Islam; and
* Posting research and updates relative to lawful Islamist organizations.

The website provides news concerning the Middle East Forum's Legal Project, established to protect in courts of law those researchers and analysts working on the topics of terrorism, terrorist funding, and Islamism.

Islamist Watch assistant director John Matthies says that "as radical Islam comes to rely on nonviolent means to impose an agenda and chill discussion, it is necessary to monitor Islamist groups full-time. The website will allow us to report our findings and serve as a resource on Islamist movements."

Middle East Forum director Daniel Pipes adds that "the Islamist Watch website will invite the public to better understand the threat posed by non-violent, political Islam to civil society and the rule of law."


Legal Project director Brooke Goldstein asserts: "The Islamist lawfare challenge poses a serious threat to our democratic freedoms. Should the voices of counter-terrorism researchers and activists be silenced, a real possibility exists that the criticism of radical Islam within our borders will end. The Islamist Watch website compliments our efforts to spread awareness about this threat and to publish updates on our wor
SO DO NOT FEAR, FOR I AM WITH YOU; DO NOT BE DISMAYED, FOR I AM YOUR GOD. I WILL STREGTHEN YOU AND HELP YOU; I WILL UPHOLD YOU WITH MY RIGHTIOUS RIGHT HAND.
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Postby Lazarus43 on Thu Mar 06, 2008 9:43 pm

jesusistheway wrote:I wonder if anyone realizes that Sam Walton made his money loaning farmers money for expansion then repoed them after they could not pay. He is probably rubbing his grubby little hands in the grave.

I had never heard that before so I tried to find information about it and have not yet found any evidence to support the slanderous statement.

Lacking any evidence, I believe that it is probably not true.

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Postby Rte66 on Fri Mar 07, 2008 6:16 am

not there yet....

Right On!!!!! :a3: ....Agree with everything you've said!!
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Postby bok on Fri Mar 07, 2008 6:45 am

sheri wrote:
Recent examples of lawful Islamism include:

* Leading Muslim students in prayer at a public San Diego elementary school.

So we want prayer in schools, but we want to deny it to others? Not very egalitarian.


* Allowing cab drivers in Vancouver, B.C. to refuse certified guide dogs for reasons of religious conviction.

There's no such thing as a "certified" guide dog. You can throw a vest on a chihuahua and call it a "therapy animal" under ADA rules.


* Admonishing doctors and nurses in Scotland to refrain from eating in front of their Muslim patients and colleagues during the month of Ramadan.

Hey Abdul! Hows the starving going... want some pizza!? HA! Avoiding rudeness isn't really advancing the creeping tide of Islam, is it?


* Proposing in the Netherlands that people of all faiths refer to God as Allah in order to "create more dialogue."

No apologies for the Dutch. They're confused enough to have a city like Amsterdam, it doesn't surprise me that they would call God allah. But for sake of argument, would you have a problem calling him YAHWEH, Jehovah, Elohim, or any of his other names?


* The Archbishop of Canterbury's arguing that adopting elements of Shari'a law in Britain would benefit social cohesion.

Archbishops don't make law in Britain. Parliament does. He has as much sway over the law there are Rosie O'Donnell does here.

* Allowing members of polygamous marriages to claim extra welfare benefits in Britain.

Seems to be a social choice. A bad one, but a choice. Would they permit Mormons the same benefits? What about Abraham, Sarah, Hagar and Katurah?

* Sponsoring a Muslim lifeguard program for the benefit of private female sessions at the city pool in Mississauga, Canada.

If there is a sizable enough population to justify private female sessions, then how could they be private if you had male lifeguards overseeing them? Ever hear of "adult swim"? How terrible to those kids to not allow them to use the pool! Our local pool is booked by private swim classes for many hours of the day. I'm just not sure I get the angle on the outrage here.

* Dropping Knorbert the piglet as mascot of Fortis Bank for fear of offending Muslims.

You mean like, "Oprima Numbero Dos por Espanol"? Seems like the bank would rather attract than repel customers. Just good business if most of your customers are Muslim... or even Jewish for that matter.

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Postby Sword of Geddon on Fri Mar 07, 2008 7:32 am

Bok willing ignorance on your part...willing ignorance.
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