Dragon in Job 41?

Discussion and debate not related to prophecy.

Dragon in Job 41?

Postby Rte66 on Mon Jun 16, 2008 5:18 am

Job 41:1 "Can you draw out Leviathan with a fishhook? Or press down his tongue with a cord?
Job 41:2 "Can you put a rope in his nose Or pierce his jaw with a hook?
Job 41:3 "Will he make many supplications to you, Or will he speak to you soft words?
Job 41:4 "Will he make a covenant with you? Will you take him for a servant forever?
Job 41:5 "Will you play with him as with a bird, Or will you bind him for your maidens?
Job 41:6 "Will the traders bargain over him? Will they divide him among the merchants?
Job 41:7 "Can you fill his skin with harpoons, Or his head with fishing spears?
Job 41:8 "Lay your hand on him; Remember the battle; you will not do it again!
Job 41:9 "Behold, your expectation is false; Will you be laid low even at the sight of him?
Job 41:10 "No one is so fierce that he dares to arouse him; Who then is he that can stand before Me?
Job 41:11 "Who has given to Me that I should repay {him?} {Whatever} is under the whole heaven is Mine.
Job 41:12 "I will not keep silence concerning his limbs, Or his mighty strength, or his orderly frame.
Job 41:13 "Who can strip off his outer armor? Who can come within his double mail?
Job 41:14 "Who can open the doors of his face? Around his teeth there is terror.
Job 41:15 "{His} strong scales are {his} pride, Shut up {as with} a tight seal.
Job 41:16 "One is so near to another That no air can come between them.
Job 41:17 "They are joined one to another; They clasp each other and cannot be separated.



Up to this point I have read commentaries that suggest this is a sea-creature, possibly a pleisiosaur, but the following verses have me thinking otherwise...




Job 41:18 "His sneezes flash forth light, And his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning.
Job 41:19 "Out of his mouth go burning torches; Sparks of fire leap forth.
Job 41:20 "Out of his nostrils smoke goes forth As {from} a boiling pot and {burning} rushes.
Job 41:21 "His breath kindles coals, And a flame goes forth from his mouth. Job 41:22 "In his neck lodges strength, And dismay leaps before him.
Job 41:23 "The folds of his flesh are joined together, Firm on him and immovable.
Job 41:24 "His heart is as hard as a stone, Even as hard as a lower millstone.
Job 41:25 "When he raises himself up, the mighty fear; Because of the crashing they are bewildered.



Fire-breathing dragon? He can light coal on fire...and we need lighter fluid!

Before Job was asked if he could draw him out with a fish hook, as if the creature was in the sea, but in the following we read about the sword, the spear, the javelin...weapons used primarily for land animals. Perhaps the Scriptures are talking about two creatures? A sea leviathan and a land leviathan?


Job 41:26 "The sword that reaches him cannot avail, Nor the spear, the dart or the javelin.
Job 41:27 "He regards iron as straw, Bronze as rotten wood.
Job 41:28 "The arrow cannot make him flee; Slingstones are turned into stubble for him.
Job 41:29 "Clubs are regarded as stubble; He laughs at the rattling of the javelin.


This next part is interesting..his underpants are potsherds? He's got spikes on his underside? And now we're back to the sea..maybe dragons lived in the sea? as well as in caves as pictured in storybooks?



Job 41:30 "His underparts are {like} sharp potsherds; He spreads out {like} a threshing sledge on the mire.
Job 41:31 "He makes the depths boil like a pot; He makes the sea like a jar of ointment.
Job 41:32 "Behind him he makes a wake to shine; One would think the deep to be gray-haired.
Job 41:33 "Nothing on earth is like him, One made without fear.
Job 41:34 "He looks on everything that is high; He is king over all the sons of pride."



It's just amazing what can be discovered in His Word!!!

Angie
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Postby Downpour on Tue Jun 17, 2008 2:09 pm

Very interesting!!

This verse is also interesting, why is he called king over the sons of pride and who are the sons of pride?

Job 41:34 "He looks on everything that is high; He is king over all the sons of pride."
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Postby Rte66 on Thu Jun 19, 2008 6:03 am

I want to look at that a little closer when VBS is over...that is interesting...
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Postby Pretzelogical on Thu Jun 19, 2008 9:41 am

Isaiah 27:1
In that day the LORD will punish Leviathan the fleeing serpent,
With His fierce and great and mighty sword,
Even Leviathan the twisted serpent;
And He will kill the dragon who lives in the sea.

Revelation 13:1
And the dragon stood on the sand of the seashore. Then I saw a beast coming up out of the sea, having ten horns and seven heads, and on his horns were ten diadems, and on his heads were blasphemous names.
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Postby Rte66 on Thu Jun 19, 2008 3:21 pm

Strong's Hebrew #7830
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46 Enhanced Strong's Lexicon: 7830 שַׁחַץ

7830 שַׁחַץ [shachats /shakh·ats/] n m. From an unused root apparently meaning to strut; TWOT 2366a; GK 8832; Two occurrences; AV translates as “lion” once, and “pride” once. 1 dignity, pride. 1a majestic wild beasts.

Its two uses:

Job 28:8 ...which the vulture’s eye hath not seen: The lion’s whelps have not trodden it, nor the ...
Job 41:34 ...he is a king over all the children of pride . Then Job answered the ...


I'm thinking double meaning here:

1) the creature being spoken about to Job by God is more powerful than all other animals...lions being considered Kings of the jungle, so to speak and its used only twice and both times in the same book so the author apparently had the "proud lion" on his mind when he described the leviathan as the king over the lion's own cub who, in animal kingdom, may become king...

2) the dragon is used for a description of Satan and Satan is king of the proud angels and people.
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Postby SueAnn on Thu Jun 19, 2008 5:16 pm

Have any of you seen the newest addition to UFO -ology? It's USO's Unidentified Submerged Objects.

Fascinating information. UFO's that go into and come out of the ocean. Somespeculation about UFO's don't disappear in the sky, they actually have their "home base" in the depths of the sea that humankind has not yet conquered.

I believe UFO's play a part in end-times. I believe UFO's are SATAN created. 100%

Is it possible that the Leviathan is Satan's "extraterrestrial" that has the sea as it's home base, but comes on land when required?
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Postby Rte66 on Fri Jun 20, 2008 6:02 am

I haven't really spent much time looking into the possible UFO connection to endtimes (Nephilim returning as some propose) and I have never heard of the theory that UFO's may be "stationed" in the oceans, but I did read the other day that the crevices in the ocean floor are deeper than the mountains are high. Lots of hiding places down there!!!
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Re: Dragon in Job 41?

Postby Shelby on Mon Jan 11, 2010 11:20 am

From what I have been reading-This leviathan spirit (king over all the children of pride) is related to narcissism and a spirit of Jezebel.

http://www.newhorizonscounseling.com/jezebelspirit.pdf


I also found some helpful articles here regarding this type of jezebel spirit. Many other type articles I found at this site were beneficial, too.
http://heavenawaits.wordpress.com/

edited to add: I said http://heavenawaits.wordpress.com/ has many beneficial articles. Actually it would have been better to say refreshing and awesome!! :)
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Re: Dragon in Job 41?

Postby CaryC on Mon Jan 18, 2010 3:33 pm

Hey,

You also might consider this:

Different ancient societies all over the world, who had no contact with each other (in other words could not share ideas, customs, thoughts etc..) all had in their ancient.....folk lore, dragons. How is that possible, unless.....unless it's not just fancy fiction, but something that actually existed.

As for the rule he had.... consider, "that old dragon"!
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Re: Dragon in Job 41?

Postby extravagantchristian on Mon Jan 18, 2010 4:43 pm

Hey I just heard this question on the radio show "To Every Man an ANswer", did one of you guys call in? :lol:
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Re: Dragon in Job 41?

Postby SueAnn on Mon Jan 18, 2010 6:18 pm

I saw a fascinating show on TV several months ago. It was about dragons and dinosauers. It looked at various cultures that have folklore containing dragons and gave the theory that what they were really about were extinct dinosauers that were still on earth when man was first here. Wish I could remember the name of the show or the channel.
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