help with toddler tantrum

[Castle]

Toddler misbehaves. Goes into meltdown mode. Throws things at walls, damages walls. Kicks doors over and over and over again. Screams, wails for 20 minutes solid. What do I do?

[shorttribber]

We have one that acted much like that. rewards for any good behaviour at all was the key for us. We would give him good boy stars and points that, when added up, he would get some little reward, ie. little toy or get to go for a short car ride...something he likes.

We would and do warm his little backside a bit or stand him in the corner...corner time....is what we call it.
He stands in the corner and repeats what he is not to do over and over.

it takes time but it is really working....of course all of these things work, coupled with prayer, and lots of hugs and being told how much he's loved as much as we can.

That's what we do.

[Spreading Salt]

One time, I dumped an entire pitcher of water over my tantrum-throwing child. It surprised us both as it was a purely random and freak thing as I was in the process of watering my house plants. He totally stopped crying and I had to hide my laughter as I told him "NO!" Worked like a charm and I just sopped it up with towels after I got him busy doing something else.

[shorttribber]

One time, I dumped an entire pitcher of water over my tantrum-throwing child. It surprised us both as it was a purely random and freak thing as I was in the process of watering my house plants. He totally stopped crying and I had to hide my laughter as I told him "NO!" Worked like a charm and I just sopped it up with towels after I got him busy doing something else.

And then there's the spontaneous method

Not a bit of planning necessary

[GodsStudent]

At two, my biggest thing was redirecting my daughter. If she was having a fit over getting a cookie, I would get an excited voice about her book or her little swing, and I would engage her in that. I would ignore that she was screaming at the top of her lungs by enticing her to come over here with mommy and do this or read that or play with this other thing.

Two is so young, imo, that redirecting her was far more in order, imo, than spanking. Redirecting took purposeful work on my part to get her to stop focusing on what she cannot have or do and change her focus to what will be acceptable for her to do. If she refused redirecting, which she did on occasion, then she would go into time out and would not be allowed out of time out until she stopped the carrying on. Most important, mom, stay calm. If you scream, then you validate the screaming and tantrum the child is doing.

My daughter had the same types of raging tantrums. I don't necessarily remember those destructive characteristics at two, but I can remember that when she would get put in time out around 5, she would throw things in her room or tear things up. It was a stage that she eventually grew out of, but at 5, I did punish her further for tearing our house up.....the punishment never stopped her from acting on the impulse to lash out and tear something up.

[Abiding in His Word]

I believe a time-out teaches children that tantrums and displays of anger are unacceptable behaviors. We used to send them to their rooms with instructions not to come out until they had calmed down. Then we could perhaps discuss what caused the outburst (depending on the age.)

We found success with this method as they lose interest in that behavior if they lose the "audience." The anger from a child is most likely directed toward the goal of controlling the parent to ensure the desired outcome. The child isn't consciously aware of that, however, but when the desired attention is denied, they give up and capitulate. Consistency is of great importance in whatever discipline is chosen.

[daffodyllady]

"Wickedness is bound in the heart of a child, but the rod of correction shall drive it far from him."

What wickedness is bound in the heart of a child? Rebellion. The Word says it is as witchcraft.

The terrible twos is when this rebellion rears its little head.
Granted, it takes real discernment to know when the child is simply too tired to cope anymore. And it also takes wisdom and love to lay the foundation of the right environment for the rod of correction.

I believe that the rod should be applied as sparingly as possible. Spankings should not be used for every misbehavior. I personally reserved the rod for rebellion.

When the rod is applied, it needs to be an occasion. It takes time. A hurried swat is not a spanking. It is an expression of parental frustration.

First, the parent must get rid of his/her own anger.
Second, the child must be taken aside, for the occasion. This underscores in the child's mind how serious his misbehavior was. It also removes shame before others.
Speak lovingly and slowly. When the child understands what is going to happen, and why, then do the job thoroughly, but not abusively. Listen carefully to the child's crying. When you have gotten through to the rebellion, the child will change his tone.

Take him in your arms, and comfort him. Make sure he knows the love you feel for him, before you let him go.

If you root out rebellion when he is two, you can change the course of his life!

As the Word says:

Pro 23:13 Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die.
Pro 23:14 Thou shalt beat him with the rod, and shalt deliver his soul from hell.

Children used to be expected to be respectful and obedient.
Too many parents these days humor rebellion in their children, and then weep over the results of their unwise parenting later, when it is too late.

[aaron]

We've gone round and round with this daffy before, I know we disagree, and that's ok. I don't mind stating that I firmly believe the church as a whole misunderstands and misinterprets the rod as it is found in Scripture. I suppose my biggest issue with it's use in justifying hitting and abusing women and children is that it's attached to God and the child grows up with a twisted view of God. I've just seen too much of it where I live, perhaps others haven't where they are.

The 'rod' is not spanking, a wooden spoon, a switch, or any other blunt object. The rod refers to either a literal 6 foot long 2 inch thick hardwood staff that would kill a child ... or a slave if used. Or the rod refers to God's authority. Go ahead and use a concordance to read of the rod's many uses throughout Scripture. My favorite use of the rod is the comfort and protection the Good Shepherd offers His sheep knowing He will fight off the wolves with His rod and protect His flock.

"If a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod and he dies at his hand, he shall be punished.

If a slave can die at the use of rod, how much more a innocent defenseless child. No, the rod in Scripture should never be used to justify hitting or beating anyone.

What then, should a God fearing Christian do that wants to honor God's Word when disciplining their children? I would suggest to dscipline them the same way God disciplines you. God doesn't smack you, he rewards faithfulness and pours His love out on us as a loving Father. When we do wrong, the Holy Spirit brings conviction and we repent and He is there waiting for us to return to Him with His loving arms wide open. My children are always being complimented on their behavior and people ask us how we achieve that behavior, the best answer I can give is that I reward them for good behavior, try as hard as I can to be an example to them, and when they do wrong, I sit them down and talk about what they did wrong and my expectations and then reward them when they are fulfilled. This seems reasonable to me in light of God's Word and how God interacts with me. Then the child doesn't grow up remembering being beaten from ages 2-8 then never again b/c some expert Christian psychologist said to do it this way.

As toddlers, my kids would throw tantrums, but I expect this from a 2 year old that is learning to express their wants and needs. This is normal, everyone goes through it, they aren't demon possessed and rebelling against God. We would sit them in a chair and wait for them to stop screaming, then again, show them what is appropriate (explaining is sometimes hard at that age). We didn't make a big deal of the tantrum and they each threw 2 or 3 doozies and that was it.

The whole rod debate won't end until the Lord returns, that I know. God knows how best to deal with each and every person and circumstance, pray and let the Holy Spirit lead you. One thing I know for sure, I've read that previous generations were very strict and harsh with their children, and as it stands now, according to the latest statistics I've been able to gather, our Christian child raising efforts are driving kids away from the faith, and I for one want to work to change that statistic.
Blessings,
A

[Salty Skipper]

Remove and distract. Go outside, to another room... engage in an activity, something new if you can think of something. Works for us.

[laney]

Great advice from most everyone.

At two, my biggest thing was redirecting my daughter. If she was having a fit over getting a cookie, I would get an excited voice about her book or her little swing, and I would engage her in that. I would ignore that she was screaming at the top of her lungs by enticing her to come over here with mommy and do this or read that or play with this other thing.

Two is so young, imo, that redirecting her was far more in order, imo, than spanking. Redirecting took purposeful work on my part to get her to stop focusing on what she cannot have or do and change her focus to what will be acceptable for her to do. If she refused redirecting, which she did on occasion, then she would go into time out and would not be allowed out of time out until she stopped the carrying on. Most important, mom, stay calm. If you scream, then you validate the screaming and tantrum the child is doing.

My daughter had the same types of raging tantrums. I don't necessarily remember those destructive characteristics at two, but I can remember that when she would get put in time out around 5, she would throw things in her room or tear things up. It was a stage that she eventually grew out of, but at 5, I did punish her further for tearing our house up.....the punishment never stopped her from acting on the impulse to lash out and tear something up.

Yes and the main thing is being consistant in the discipline each time it happens.
Great examples Lisa!

[brandon]

I have a 4 year old and an almost 3 year old. My almost 3 year old son loves to say "no". We have a process where we discuss that his behavior is disobedient, and that the consequence for disobedience is a spanking. He typically gets 10 swats to the rear, usually with a small wooden spoon. He gets very upset if he knows the behavior he has exhibited deserves a spanking and he doesn't get one, which is actually a good thing.

After the spanking, we pray a Gospel centered prayer, he says he's sorry, I forgive him, we hug and kiss, and he says sorry to anyone else impacted. He's also at the age where he may have to make restitution, depending on the crime committed.

My 4 year old gets spankings as well, but he tends to be more compliant and so he gets them less (and usually less severe).

I believe not spanking a child is a form of abuse and scriptural disobedience.

My wife and I are very physical with our children, and not just for discipline. We both give our children lots of positive physical affection (hugs, kisses, wrestling and playing, etc). I believe this is an area that previous generations failed to balance loving physical discipline with loving physical affection.

With that said, there's some great ideas here as well. I've personally done the "water" thing before when one of our boys gets overwhelmed by emotion. It is like a shock to their system, and helps get them out of the thing that they were feeling that caused them to explode toddler-style.

As a dad, I have to use all available tools to use the experience to teach them about their need for the Gospel. Sometimes I have to play "big, angry dad" (and every boy needs a healthy fear of crossing their father), but that's usually an act - during the actual spanking, regardless of how I feel at that moment, I have to remain calm and in control of my own emotions. I believe you can be angry when you spank and not spank out of anger, but it takes self-control.

I've found that yelling, in and of itself, will not get you anywhere - the child loses respect, and I've noticed it causes more rebellion than it solves.

Also - as a husband, when I am home, I tend to do 95% of the disciplining. My wife is a full time homemaker who does part time work, so the kids run her ragged all day long. When I'm home and I see my sons being disobedient or disrespectful to her, they know they're toast - I will not stand for them treating her like garbage, and I tell them why. It's a great opportunity for me to show them that my wife (and all women) deserve to be treated well and protected.

If you hadn't noticed, this is something I am very passionate about. I'll share that my church has a number of larger families (2 w/ 5 kids a piece, and several others w/ 3-4) and that most members, and definitely the church leadership, have practiced spanking. One family, who heads up the youth and children's ministry for the church, have a mom, eldest daughter on a 2 week missions trip, and a 14 year old daughter who is on a 3-4 week missions trip to China. I believe that when you surround the spanking experience (and parenting in general) with the Gospel, you are more likely to produce children who aren't fake church kids, but real regenerate children of God!

There are no guarantees, of course - it is God who chooses who will be saved and who will be condemned - but God uses godly parenting and Gospel centered discipline to draw his elect children to Himself. How glorious! My great hope, as a father, is that when I meet the Lord Jesus face to face, He says "well done" to how I've tried my best to honor Him and make Him the center of my parenting.

Ultimately, the responsibility falls on dad for how the children are raised. That's why, up until the early 1850's, the vast majority of child rearing books were written for fathers! I would just encourage every father or soon to be father on this board to seek God in every area of parenting - God holds you accountable for your children and how you steward them.

[brandon]

The whole rod debate won't end until the Lord returns, that I know. God knows how best to deal with each and every person and circumstance, pray and let the Holy Spirit lead you. One thing I know for sure, I've read that previous generations were very strict and harsh with their children, and as it stands now, according to the latest statistics I've been able to gather, our Christian child raising efforts are driving kids away from the faith, and I for one want to work to change that statistic.

The biggest reason children leave is because they never knew the Gospel of Jesus - they were taught Moralistic Therapeutic Deism.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XzTm3W2Ai7s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hAmxx5f00Xw

Moralistic Therapeutic Deism is literally a form of legalism - if you do these things well, your life will be blessed. If you do these things bad, your life will be cursed. So by being good and obedient, you will avoid suffering, which flat out isn't true.

If your theology teaches that all suffering is a form of sin, and then someone suffers not directly due to their sin, it invalidates the theology, and you get people leaving. That's why the prosperity gospel is bunk.

[aaron]

brandon, you made many good points, I'm glad that you're so involved with your children. What I encounter most is dads who's only role in rearing their children is discipline and that breaks my heart. As I reflect on my relationship with God I think about all the times He as been there for me and has answered my prayers. To show love and affection to your child just like your heavenly father is crucial.

I know this is a discussion board and we'll always disagree on some issues and that's fine with me.

I believe not spanking a child is a form of abuse and scriptural disobedience.

As believers there are things we don't agree on, as long as you know why you believe what you believe that's what's important to me. I believe this statement of yours would fall on the harsh side of the discussion.

In the 31,103 verses in the Bible (give or take depending on translation) there are 4 that talk about beating a child with a rod. The Bible directly contradicts that statement when it mentions beating a slave with a rod and death. I don't really want to go round and round with the rod and it's meaning, but scriptural disobedience?

We aren't commanded or exhorted to ever hit our kids, to 'spank' them (not in Scripture), that not 'spanking' them is a form of abuse, that Scriptural disobedience comes from not 'spanking' them, that 'spanking' them with a wooden spoon is 'beating them with a rod'. (How can you make that connection?) Beating them with a rod can not deliver their soul from hell. What saves their soul is repenting of their sin and trusting in Christ for salvation.

My thoughts don't have the intent to mock or belittle by any means, I just flat out don't understand why parents spank their kids and connect that form of discipline with the Bible or Christianity, and I may never understand and that's fine. I wasn't spanked as a child ... I often wonder if people who were spanked as a child will in turn spank their children as a way to cope with a childhood memory, but I'll never know the answer to that one either.

Abuse comes in many forms, verbal, emotional, physical, spiritual, but a father who teaches his children to love and serve God and believe the Gospel and doesn't spank them is in no way abusing them or disobeying anything found in Scripture.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYV7hpD9JTI

I do hope these thoughts fall into line with the subject of this thread, if not please let me know. Blessings all. -A

[Abiding in His Word]

This has been around since the early '70's, but has a lot of wisdom applicable to this topic.

If children live with criticism, they learn to condemn.
If children live with hostility, they learn to fight.
If children live with fear, they learn to be apprehensive.
If children live with pity, they learn to feel sorry for themselves.
If children live with ridicule, they learn to feel shy.
If children live with jealousy, they learn to feel envy.
If children live with shame, they learn to feel guilty.
If children live with encouragement, they learn confidence.
If children live with tolerance, they learn patience.
If children live with praise, they learn appreciation.
If children live with acceptance, they learn to love.
If children live with approval, they learn to like themselves.
If children live with recognition, they learn it is good to have a goal.
If children live with sharing, they learn generosity.
If children live with honesty, they learn truthfulness.
If children live with fairness, they learn justice.
If children live with kindness and consideration, they learn respect.
If children live with security, they learn to have faith in themselves and in those about them.
If children live with friendliness, they learn the world is a nice place in which to live.

We do pass on our attitudes, beliefs, prejudices, etc. to our children by our conduct. Their behavior usually reflects that of their parents. That's not true in all cases as they get older and form their own character, and some obviously do stray from even the best examples set during their formative years, but parents are responsible for providing the best example possible and then entrusting that child to the care of the Lord.

[GodsStudent]

Hi Abiding: I really loved that quote you posted, the "if children live with" thing. As a guardian ad litem for children who've been put in situations where physical repercussions were extended upon them, I truly believe that if parents can find an alternative way of discipline as a PRIMARY MEANS, all involved are likely to benefit from it. I've seen the horrendous cases that more than likely many here could never get involved in, but I've also seen those cases where the parents had good reason to be highly emotive due to something their kids did, and they got too angry, and took their actions too far. For example, a case where a father never really beat his kids, but he did use corporal punishment, and when a woman in the neighborhood called him to her house to tell him that she just caught his teenage daughter and her son in an inappropriate act, his emotions got the best of him and he went too far in discipline. In the moment, he was distraught, he was embarrassed, and he was overwhelmed by his own feelings so that he was not able to contain himself, and as a result, he hit his child along the legs and on the back and that's against the law. He was flailing in his humanity.....all humans do it.....but that's against the law, and as a result, the family was torn down by the state and all endured quite a lot before it could be put back together again. (Note: Elements to the story are fictional here as I must ensure, as a guardian, that no connection to the real case could be made, but the primary points are made, without exaggeration).

If parents don't have good, non physical mechanisms for dealing with children ahead of crisis, parents are at high risk, because there are things that would make any parent "lose it" in a crisis....PARTICULARLY those parents who think highly of the things they do in their parenting.....What happens to the parent who is so proud that they did everything "by the book" and yet their teen exhibits great rebellion, and particularly if it's rebellion that results in the parent being publicly humiliated?

Yes, I have used corporal punishment with my child, but I have very actively sought non physical ways to discipline, and in almost all cases, I go the non physical route, because I can easily look back on the years that have thus far passed and say that I have been out of line....be it too angry, too tired, ...too tired of a certain behavior.....all of the above. A little self honesty would require that most parents would have to say the same thing. In this pressure cooker world we live in now, it's vital that parents recognize that they have and can make mistakes in parenting, and as a result, they need to have attitudes that make great allowances for errors that could come up, so that you don't put yourself or your family at risk for greater problems, such as hitting them in the wrong place with the belt or flip flop, leaving a mark, and having that mark translate into CPS nightmares that so many people are going through. There are the horrible abuse cases where "parenting" had nothing to do with it, but there are A WHOLE LOT of cases where a parent lost it just one time, and in that time, they left a mark or a bruise, or some other circumstance ensued, and the results are catastrophic to the family, and most of all, to the parent's ability to actually parent their child after the child is returned home.

Think about it. Everyone who has a child at home should think about this hard and honestly with themselves.

[daffodyllady]

I also believe that even though spanking is a very effective tool to use with a child who is under 8 years old, I begins to lose its effectiveness at that age.

I remember the last spanking I gave my daughter. It was always effective until she was in the fourth grade. Her daddy had just left the family, and she had almost lost faith in the existence of a good God.

So, she comes home from school, and spits out the most horrible stuff at me, that she had learned at school. Rebellious and hard.

I took her to the bathroom, and talked with her about what she did. I was not getting through to her heart. So, as I had up to that point, I applied the rod. But this time, she stood there, with her chin jutting out, silently waiting for me to stop.

I saw she was really hardening her heart. I began to cry, telling her how much I loved her. I told her that what I was seeing at that point was really scaring me, because I knew that path led to hell. "Oh honey, I don't want you to end up in hell!" And she began to cry.

She never needed a spanking again. Which was a good thing, because it wouldn't have done any good. She had grown up too much.

I think a lot of parents have given spanking a bad name, because they use it wrong.
Hitting a child in anger crosses the line into abuse. So does spanking a child who has entered puberty.

Just my humble opinion.

Also... as far as legalism... the law was made for the disobedient.
We have to teach children the wages of sin are real, before they can understand why Jesus had to die on the cross.